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thefrenchowl 1st August 2021 12:50

Was researching the Bernoulli effect (whatever that is, I'm NOT an engineer!!!) and glad I did so cause I came about another Leo Payne Bonneville shot, circa 1969/1970, before the Harley Hospital paint scheme...

About the B****** effect, the 1970 streamliner don't seem to have suffered from it, all the shots I can see show an open bellmouth... Probably because the air flow was quite smooth along side this long cigar.

However, Warner Riley seem to have suffered from it since his 1972 Bonneville 206.544 mph campaign show an air dam around his carb entry:

His secondary gearing was a mouth watering 25/28 teeth with overall ratio of 1.94 and running 92% nitro... and still running a KR/XLR frame.


Chuckthebeatertruck 1st August 2021 13:12


Originally Posted by Ferrous Head (Post 5908315)
I honestly thought this was just done as a joke thread. ?

I was clear in my first post.

I had carb in my hand and apart. I photographed and noted and measured and discussed with owner.

I also was clear I expected bullshido.

Why. . .

Well because the normal ASSumptions are made that when coupled with poor reading comprehension lead to the xl forum's famous wasted space.

If you need a thread title to Hansen and Gretl your way through the world. . . you sure ain't Leo Payne.

thefrenchowl 1st August 2021 13:42

Maybe it's simpler than that Chuckthebeatertruck....

In 1969, I was young and in France and only knew Mert Lawwill and the KRTT... while riding a 30mph moped...

These days, all's outmoded once it's 3 months old...

I've seen kids playing Purple Haze or Foxy Lady and they don't have a clue who the foxx's Jimi Hendrix...

Curiosity.... That's all it takes...

I don't care anymore anyway, if I fancy a posting, I'll chime in, but I do it cause I can add a bit, I don't do it for reward or recognition...


brucstoudt 2nd August 2021 23:00


Originally Posted by thefrenchowl (Post 5906529)

Patrick this looks alot like Craig Rivera from your other Bonnevile thread.sponsor yes.he was a sponsor of the record setting H-D streamliner in your recent thread.

Ferrous Head 2nd August 2021 23:26


I don't care anymore anyway, if I fancy a posting, I'll chime in, but I do it cause I can add a bit, I don't do it for reward or recognition...
Sorry Patrick, I think that was aimed at me, not you.

And no, I'm not a Leo Payne.

But I am the only one who turned up at the Salt Flats in Australia this year riding an Ironhead powered bike. Technically, I have the fastest Ironhead in Australia.
And I'm blind and 70 years old but still, having a go. Still trying out different things on the bike and trying to make it faster in the real world.

I'm not basking in someone else's past glory.

But I DO APPRECIATE the thread. I love the old race stuff. I do wonder where it has all gone. I wonder what will become of all the old race bikes I built when I am long gone.

Had you titled this "Best carb for a 96" Nitro Burner" there would be no controversy at all. (Thread would have finished after the first post)

IronMick 3rd August 2021 01:17


Originally Posted by Ferrous Head (Post 5908645)
... I DO APPRECIATE the thread. I love the old race stuff...

Me too :)

ryder rick 3rd August 2021 01:33

I've been told the best carb for an Ironhead is a Tilotson.

They make the most power when you get them right.
Sort of a vacuum operated fuel injector! :smoke

Not going to beat Leo's carb, in that application.....

thefrenchowl 3rd August 2021 10:28


Gene: Sorry Patrick, I think that was aimed at me, not you.
I did not take any criticism here personally, Gene, just saying I'll barge in regardless of what folks think of me or my endeavours!!!

I know mrmom9r said somewhere else sommat in the lines "I should 1st get a world championship before being allowed to criticise Honda"... BUT...

I'm entitled to my opinions and so, here's another...

This thread is more or less dedicated to the great Leo Payne...

Yes, BUT... I have the feeling fame came a bit to his head and he lost the plot along the way...

Like starting a nitro bike on the rollers and clutching it from a stand still to impress the adoring crowds and in the process bending his rods, Bonneville 1971, and so bagging s***e all on that Speed Week...

In 1970, he was still Top Gun, but guess who Harley-Davidson invited to build the streamliner nitro engine? A guy still learning with George, in the shadows but a lot more methodical than Leo, I give you Warner Riley. And George Smith did not bat an eyelid and went along with it.

So Leo faded and Warner came to the front...

Never mind past history, you're only as good as your last job/result.

So we give here thanks to Leo and George efforts to prototype THE nitro carb...

Later on, Leo faded away while George built an empire out of that common adventure...

Don't forget George was still operating in 1969 from his home garage in the evenings while having a day job as foreman at Wyman-Gordon


thefrenchowl 3rd August 2021 10:58

Another nice shot of Warner showing the S&S home made air dam...


Ferrous Head 3rd August 2021 16:57


"I should 1st get a world championship before being allowed to criticise Honda"
I have to admit I am a great admirer of their lawnmowers. Mine is now 18 years old and still runs like a top !
Their bikes ? Not so much. (Did kinda lie the Early 1000 R's)

We used "still air boxes" on our Kawasaki Superbikes back in the early 80's as just running bell mouths wasn't as effective.
With the way air flows at speed unless you have a big enough space around the inlet the air flow DOES get affected. I know that much.
I also know facing the inlet forwards doesn't work well.

I do have a memento from Leo Payne his 1970 parts book. But it doesn't seem to be any faster than my 1958 parts book.

Oh no. seems I've become irreverent over time. Or is that irrelevant ? I forget.

I take my hat off to anyone who spends hours and hours and great piles of money to go racing.
But the time when an individual could take out a World Championship was before I was born.I expect if Microsoft decided to go racing they could throw enough money at it to take one out within two years. Don;t know what it ould prove though.

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