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  #21  
Old 18th September 2009
Screw Loose Dan's Avatar
Screw Loose Dan Screw Loose Dan is offline
I think I like Sportsters
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rehit View Post
torque values can easliy be researched on the net.
there are torque tables posted by the bolt manufacturers.
the engineers at Harley do not have some magic formula used for motorcycles.
all engineers including myself use these charts when creating specs for the machines we build.
Bolt Torque Chart

And this is precisely why I think the mistake begins with the parts manual. Wrong diameter bolt listed = wrong torque value. I suspect they have all this in a database or something and it just compiles this information automatically.
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  #22  
Old 18th September 2009
Kirk the Jerk Kirk the Jerk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rehit View Post
torque values can easliy be researched on the net.
there are torque tables posted by the bolt manufacturers.
the engineers at Harley do not have some magic formula used for motorcycles.
all engineers including myself use these charts when creating specs for the machines we build.
Bolt Torque Chart

Those are probably the maximum torque those bolts can carry. The other main variable to consider is the material of the female threads. When it's brittle aluminum like the primary cover, well...
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  #23  
Old 18th September 2009
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Woody01 Woody01 is offline
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Thanks for the bolt chart link, Rehit!

For everyone else, MC is not going to admit a problem on their end.

But if they were smart, they should take the time and research this thru their dealer's maintenance shops and get a feel of what their view is on this issue.
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  #24  
Old 18th September 2009
Screw Loose Dan's Avatar
Screw Loose Dan Screw Loose Dan is offline
I think I like Sportsters
 
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Originally Posted by Woody01 View Post
For everyone else, MC is not going to admit a problem on their end.
Normally I would agree with this statement. But, they did fix MindfulRider's under warranty, so that is some assumption of a problem. There is hope! Also, don't underestimate the power of this forum we are on.
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  #25  
Old 18th September 2009
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Originally Posted by Screw Loose Dan View Post
Normally I would agree with this statement. But, they did fix MindfulRider's under warranty, so that is some assumption of a problem. There is hope! Also, don't underestimate the power of this forum we are on.
I was reading the end of your reply .... don't underestimate the power of this forum we are on.

I think we also can read it as ... don't underestimate the power of this forum, we are one.

I often wondered if the MC had their interest groups (company spies) reading the XL Forum to come up with ideas. After all, we are their market-place and life-blood of their industry. We are the ones in the field riding and testing the fruit of their labor. Members are continually showing them things can be done differently and better on numerous ocassions.
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  #26  
Old 18th September 2009
09 blackthunder 09 blackthunder is offline
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The warranty guy has mine covered. So I'm good on that. The dealer is even willing for me to come pick up the cover when it comes in and I can put it on myself and I told me I have all my records plus more, I don't mind them doing it just want to make sure it's done right and I don't wanna be charged for anything. They know i'm frustrated and I mentioned everything about what we have all talked about here to him this morning and made my points from the gasket crap to the large increase in torque values and and the torque values with the different diameters in screws and bolts plus the material that the nightster cover is made out of compared to the models that have chrome that are stronger but still need to be safe. So just have to wait for the cover to come in and go from their.

It sucks because I was supposed to go on this big bike run and now I can't because I wanted to ride that bike. I can always ride one of my others but not the same.
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  #27  
Old 19th September 2009
diouxsie diouxsie is offline
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Default 2009 Owner's Manual (International Models)

2009 Owner's Manual (International Models)

Manual with print date of 11/08 (printed in USA)

Primary Chain Inspection Cover (Torque Value): 9.5-13.5 Nm (84-120 in-lbs) -> ERROR!!!
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  #28  
Old 19th September 2009
Screw Loose Dan's Avatar
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Originally Posted by diouxsie View Post
2009 Owner's Manual (International Models)

Manual with print date of 11/08 (printed in USA)

Primary Chain Inspection Cover (Torque Value): 9.5-13.5 Nm (84-120 in-lbs) -> ERROR!!!
Thanks!!

Any chance you can confirm your page numbers are the same as what I have listed in the first post? I'm not sure what changes with the different print dates.
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  #29  
Old 19th September 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirk the Jerk View Post
Those are probably the maximum torque those bolts can carry. The other main variable to consider is the material of the female threads. When it's brittle aluminum like the primary cover, well...
the chart gives the proof load (maximum) and clamp loads for the fasteners.
it also lists the tightening torque which is what we would be interested in.
without going into some long technical discussion of strengths of materials and their uses these values can be used for most common applications.
the use of loctite or a never sieze component can alter the values somewhat.
most torque values included in user manuals are a cover your ass inclusion more than they are a needed practice.
things like heads and anything with a broad surface and a gasket need to be tightened evenly and using a torque wrench facilitates this need.
when we assemble the equipment we build we only use torque wrenchs in places like i have described above.
the values of all fasteners (even ones we do not torque) would be included in the specs manual for the CYA reason...
the main reason you see a torque value in mass produced equipment is so the assembly line set up techs can set the air wrenchs to values that will not wring off the bolts but will tighten them sufficiently.
i feel quite secure advising people they can use the torque charts on the net working on anything by using the size of the fastener in question to determine the torque value.
this does not excuse the obvious error included in the HD manual.
perhaps someone should send HD the link to the chart...
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  #30  
Old 19th September 2009
diouxsie diouxsie is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Screw Loose Dan View Post
Thanks!!

Any chance you can confirm your page numbers are the same as what I have listed in the first post? I'm not sure what changes with the different print dates.
You're welcome.
The page numbers are NOT the same has yours - it depends from the translation languages. The manuals are printed in USA, but in different languages, so the page numbers could be also differents from country to country.
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