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  #101  
Old 28th May 2018
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Originally Posted by felis View Post
some people are dinosaurs who resist change.
If we weren't dinosaurs who resist change, we wouldn't be riding Harleys at all!

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  #102  
Old 28th May 2018
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Originally Posted by webman94 View Post
This has been a fascinating discussion, lots of interesting points. I actually don't think the air cooled sportster is going away, but I fully expect some significant changes. Moto Guzzi introduced its V9 series a couple of years ago, and it was specifically designed to meet the most stringent EU rules. It does so with.... wait for it... an air cooled, two valve v-twin. I'm sure HD has taken a good look at how Guzzi did this, and has plans for a revised sportster engine that will meet these same standards. I'd like to see an oil cooled, counterbalanced solid mount with at least as much power as now, but weighing in at under 500lbs. That would be a major win, and I fully believe they're capable of pulling it off.

EDIT: Royal Enfield is also introducing a new air cooled 650 twin next year in Europe and the US, so they must have also figured out how to meet these regulations. If RE can do it... (actually, I really like their stuff, for some reason )
I'm not sure Guzzi or RE are good examples from a hp/L standpoint.

And I'm not sure how many more years of tightening regulations either motor will pass.

Guzzi is supposedly working on a water-cooled or Wethead bike right now.
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  #103  
Old 28th May 2018
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So it seems to me that the Sporty we know today will not be the same in the future. Not sure which year the future starts, but change is on the way.So far this is what I am getting from this thread.

I will now guess that we see the same suspension/frame, but with a totally new engine. Yes, just one. The variant in the Sportster will not be 883 or 1200, just the models. I think this new improved engine will be over 1200cc but not by a lot. Maybe even less cc but with more hp, I'm thinking 85 hp or more. Water cooled probably if meeting emissions is the main objective and keeping cost relatively the same is on the table.

Then with the Sporty having the more powerful new engine, the MoCo will make the Street more appealing to the younger crowd. It just might even make the Sporty more appealing to some of the Dyna riders that didn't like the suspension change.

Anyways that's my newest guess. I also think it would be nice if the new Sporty had a divorced transmission, or at least the trap door came back. But I doubt that.

So how long do I have to wait until HD annouces the 2019 models?

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  #104  
Old 28th May 2018
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I have noticed that the water cooled Boxer retains an air cooled look. that is encouraging if you think about it.
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  #105  
Old 28th May 2018
webman94 webman94 is offline
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Originally Posted by Bone View Post
I'm not sure Guzzi or RE are good examples from a hp/L standpoint.

And I'm not sure how many more years of tightening regulations either motor will pass.

Guzzi is supposedly working on a water-cooled or Wethead bike right now.
I hear you, I'm just saying that it seems that they've figured out how to make it work. The RE is supposed to be tuned to meet the EU's 47hp limit for one of their licensing rules. It's a 650, so you'd think that HD should be able to be in the mid 60's with a 1200 in a similar state of tune. I know it's hard for HD to think about, but if they put the sportster on a diet, less horsepower/torque wouldn't be such a problem.

I heard about Guzzi working on a watercooled bike, too, but I was under the impression that it was destined for their bigger, more powerful bikes, not the V9 series. I could be wrong, but they spent a great deal of money developing the V9, relative to their sales, so I don't think the V9's going anywhere. They also advertised heavily that they'd designed it to meet the 2020 regulations when it debuted. Guzzi gets away with a fairly mild state of tune on this bike because it's almost 100lbs. lighter than a rubbermount sportster.
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  #106  
Old 28th May 2018
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Originally Posted by spitfirechopper View Post
The royal enfields had my attention from the get go but when the 650 twin was announced i actually started putting money aside. Unfortunately after talking to people who own them, it's not a bike you will ever want to get wet, build quality is quite cheap and they rust quicker than you can say "where did i put that WD40", i'll still probably get one though.
I've heard that, too. Fortunately, I live in the deserts of the southwestern US. No rust here! Lots of dust, though!
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  #107  
Old 28th May 2018
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Quote:
Originally Posted by webman94 View Post
I hear you, I'm just saying that it seems that they've figured out how to make it work. The RE is supposed to be tuned to meet the EU's 47hp limit for one of their licensing rules. It's a 650, so you'd think that HD should be able to be in the mid 60's with a 1200 in a similar state of tune. I know it's hard for HD to think about, but if they put the sportster on a diet, less horsepower/torque wouldn't be such a problem.

I heard about Guzzi working on a watercooled bike, too, but I was under the impression that it was destined for their bigger, more powerful bikes, not the V9 series. I could be wrong, but they spent a great deal of money developing the V9, relative to their sales, so I don't think the V9's going anywhere. They also advertised heavily that they'd designed it to meet the 2020 regulations when it debuted. Guzzi gets away with a fairly mild state of tune on this bike because it's almost 100lbs. lighter than a rubbermount sportster.
I think you're correct and we're expecting something I'm the 1200cc range that's water-cooled from Guzzi. Perhaps something to replace their defunct SSSA (CARC) bikes (Breva/Norge/Griso/Stelvio).

And yes they do appear to be continuing to expand the smallblocks, the next due is supposedly going to be an 80 hp (Italian hp, so maybe just a boldface lie), 2V, air-cooled, V85. We'll see.

As for Harley though because of their size they need a bike to have longer legs in terms of yearly sales totals and number of viable years for it to be worth it. Sadly all of Guzzis sales in a year would be a total failure for one model of a Harley.
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  #108  
Old 28th May 2018
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The Sporty will be around for as long as girls ride motorcycles.
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  #109  
Old 28th May 2018
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Originally Posted by cotton1 View Post
....
So how long do I have to wait until HD annouces the 2019 models?

Cotton1

Not long. But I don't think that will tell you much.
Harley's not shutting down the current Kansas City Sportster plant until the fall of 2019.
So, they should be making similar Sportsters at least until then.

I'm thinking when the 2020 models are announced,
they will be starting to come off the new line in York Pa.,
and that's when a big change may happen.
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  #110  
Old 28th May 2018
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I've heard that, too. Fortunately, I live in the deserts of the southwestern US. No rust here! Lots of dust, though!
Here hear. Our requirements are different than others.

Water cooling would not be a show stopper for me. But I own old iron anyways. As far as dinosaurs go.
I bet one of those gene finders places would find some dino genes/microbes/parts in me.

Until sporty comes out with a adventure bike. I will stick with what I have.
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