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Sportster Motorcycle Motor - Top End Discuss Sportster Motorcycle Top End issues. Rockerboxes, Valves, Cylinders, Pistons, Rings, Lift Rods, etc...

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pushrods, s&s, top end rebuild

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  #1  
Old 13th October 2018
T_worth T_worth is offline
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Default S&S pushrod adjustment

I’m fininshing my top end rebuild on my 96’ sportster 1200. While doing it, I was surprised to find out the previous owner had installed S&S adjustable pushrods. I think S&S valve springs too (because I have 3 valve springs instead of the stock 2). I need help figuring out how to adjust these correctly.

http://www.manualsdir.com/manuals/57...ds.html?page=2

I was following the link above, but when I had the front cylinder TDC on the compression stroke with exhaust tappet at lowest position, the exhaust pushrod had 0 up and down play for me to adjust to. I called a S&S technician, and he said it doesn’t matter what stroke you’re own or which pushrod you start with. As long as the tappet you’re working on is in the lowest position, you’re fine.

I scrapped the link and followed his directions. I did in fact get the proper up and down play, which I then adjusted the pushrod’s bottom ball end to just sit on the tappet. Then I increased pushrod compression to 24 Flats and tighten the locknut.

Can anyone please tell me if I did this correctly? I’m only doubting the technician cause it’s so different from the pushrod manual. And all the YouTube tutorials seem to only do the adjustment on ironheads. Please help before I damage my pistons
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  #2  
Old 13th October 2018
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if you zeroed the lash and then added 24 flats for pre-load, you should be good to go. the pre-load will prevent the plunger and retainer from contacting. i run the rivera units and set them for .030, yep, closer than most people, they usually get squeamish below .050. the s&s literature tpi info should tell you the clearance per turn, i have diff tpi.
(to clarify> .030 is at the lifter, rocker ratio not factored but stem clearance would be around the .050 mark) just enough to quieten the valve train, it will run up the 7.5 limiter more solid like.
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Old 13th October 2018
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Great. That's reassuring. So does it really matter if the pushrods are adjusted while on the compression stroke? Everything I've been reading talks about having cylinder at TDC on compression stroke, but I wasn't getting any good results that way. I'm afraid of valve to piston contact if I don't do it on TDC compression stroke.

I adjusted all of the pushrods the way I explained earlier last night. I'm gonna head back to the garage today and double check each pushrod after waiting for it to be bled and check. Should I increase tension if theres free play? or just leave it at the standard 24 flats?
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  #4  
Old 13th October 2018
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TDC compression stroke has the advantage to let you adjust both intake and exhaust pushrods at that cylinder.
Say you adjusted the front, wait 20- 30 min, then turn the engine to have TDC compression at rear cylinder, so you can adjust both exhaust and intake rear pushrods.
Wait another 20-30 min then you can start the motor.

In theory you can adjust the pushrod you want IF you are SURE that the relative valve is fully closed (lifter at the base circle of the respective cam).
BUT it's difficult to say when a lifter is at the base circle of the cam with the cam cover on. In this case you should rely on pushrods movement.
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  #5  
Old 13th October 2018
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I didn't have any freeplay with pushrods zeroed out, and with the front cylinder at TDC compression stroke. Perhaps I'm doing it all wrong.

I stuffed the sparkplug hole with a rag and turned the engine. When the rag popped out, I slowly turned the engine until TDC. That is when I don't have any freeplay on the front cylinder. Am I crazy or just doing it wrong?
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Old 13th October 2018
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T_worth View Post
I didn't have any freeplay with pushrods zeroed out, and with the front cylinder at TDC compression stroke. Perhaps I'm doing it all wrong.

I stuffed the sparkplug hole with a rag and turned the engine. When the rag popped out, I slowly turned the engine until TDC. That is when I don't have any freeplay on the front cylinder. Am I crazy or just doing it wrong?
What you mean with:
" I didn't have any freeplay with pushrods zeroed out, and with the front cylinder at TDC compression stroke"?

Put the front cylinder at tdc on Compression stroke.
http://www.hammerperf.com/ttspotcheckcamtiming.shtml

then make the pushrod short as much you can. Then extend the pushrod with the adjuster up to the point you have no play between the pushrod and the tappet. (this is ZERO lash). There is a moment where you can still do some Up-down movement, then extending just a litte more you have 0 lash.
Now you can extend the pushrods the number of flats S&S suggest.

When you have finished you will not be able to turn the pushrod with your fingers. Allow 10 to 20 to 30 mins that the tapped bleed oil. At that point you will be able to turn the pushrod with fingers with slight drag.
GO to next pushrod.
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Old 13th October 2018
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bustert View Post
if you zeroed the lash and then added 24 flats for pre-load, you should be good to go. the pre-load will prevent the plunger and retainer from contacting. i run the rivera units and set them for .030, yep, closer than most people, they usually get squeamish below .050. the s&s literature tpi info should tell you the clearance per turn, i have diff tpi.
(to clarify> .030 is at the lifter, rocker ratio not factored but stem clearance would be around the .050 mark) just enough to quieten the valve train, it will run up the 7.5 limiter more solid like.
You need the lifters preloaded enough to compensate for top end growth as the motor gets hot. That's really why .050" is considered the minimum.
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Old 13th October 2018
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very true. some even like to split the diff of the plunger stroke. so far no issues with the .030 down from the retainer, want it to run like a solid.
you can set them both ways, i just start at the back and work forward. if #1 intake is up, i know #2 intake is down, etc.
i forgot to mention i do run s&s travel limiters so i do not have full stroke to begin with.
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Old 14th October 2018
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Alright. So I rechecked my work. I made sure the front cylinder was at TDC on the compression stroke. Adjusted pushrods, then moved on to the rear cylinder at TDC-Compressiom. I followed Conv90 guideance and made exhaust pushrod the shortest length then extended it to pre-load and then extended it 24 flats. I waited 30mins for each pushrod to bleed out. Then did the intake.

The odd thing I noticed was they were just as finger loose as I started before rechecking my work. Either I had adjusted them correctly last night or they were already bleed from last night. Either way, I feel more confident that they’re adjusted correctly.


#1 intake is up, while #2 intake is down. #1 exhaust up, while #2 exhaust is down.

If there’s anything else I should check, or a better way to ensure the adjustment is dead on. Please let me know
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Old 14th October 2018
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T_worth View Post
Alright. So I rechecked my work. I made sure the front cylinder was at TDC on the compression stroke. Adjusted pushrods, then moved on to the rear cylinder at TDC-Compressiom. I followed Conv90 guideance and made exhaust pushrod the shortest length then extended it to pre-load and then extended it 24 flats. I waited 30mins for each pushrod to bleed out. Then did the intake.

change "pre-load" to "0 lash" THEN extends 24 flats.

The odd thing I noticed was they were just as finger loose as I started before rechecking my work. Either I had adjusted them correctly last night or they were already bleed from last night. Either way, I feel more confident that they’re adjusted correctly.

Yes, probably already bleed. Usually when tappets are with oil on it it needs from 10 min to 30 bleed ..depending of the bleed rate of the tappet. Presumably you started to recheck your work the day later ..so they were bleed, so your finger loose sensation

#1 intake is up, while #2 intake is down. #1 exhaust up, while #2 exhaust is down.

If there’s anything else I should check, or a better way to ensure the adjustment is dead on. Please let me know
If you have not started the bike you can put the front at TDC compression and you can see if pushrods can be turned by fingers. Then you can check the rear with the same method (Rear at TDC compression). If you already started the bike you should wait the aforementioned 10 to 30 min.
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