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electric start, relay, runaway starter, solenoid, wiring

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  #1  
Old 17th August 2010
aciddeath aciddeath is offline
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Arrow 79 starter runaway assistance

runaway starter assistance..
79 estart only ironhead
totally new to the IH game

Got a charged up battery (12.50v, genny brings it over 13v), fires off the first or second crank
starter almost always sounds like it keeps turning.. sometimes it stops(?) and the bike can be ridden fine. Wiring is jacked?

dying to get the tech book. Going to bring back a brake tool tomorrow so I can get the HD manual.


What do I check? I still have the old style brown relay... but isn't a relay either good or bad (on / off) not able to get 'stuck'?? I heard that from a guy but then on here a search reveals advice that is to the contrary.

This is a mega pain -- what do I check?
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  #2  
Old 17th August 2010
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this is a common problem.

even my ironhead (79) does it from time to time..
your solenoid stay's stuck sometime.. this will keep the starter spinning.
for a simple check: when the starter keeps on turning give it a whack with a screwdriver or something. you should hit the rear part of the starter, this is the solenoid.the shorter cylindrical doohickey..
if he stops the solenoid is bad.



you can replace it, or fix it yourself.or make a kicker on it!
or make it a manual type..with a push button on the solenoid.


this is not the type for an ironhead...



since you are getting a manual wait until you have it before you make your choice.


good choice btw on a '79!

many are bitching and wining about '79ers but they never owned one.
engine is just the same as any other '80s iron, with one extra: you can make it a kicker with little effort!
some nag about the frame.. it's the same as the much wanted and loved XLCR.. even the engine is roughly the same including the odd master brake cylinder placement.

welcome to the small and elite group of '79 owners!
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  #3  
Old 18th August 2010
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nativebroncofan nativebroncofan is offline
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Welcome to the forum,

Battery aside (fully charged)the bike run a wire from the battery - to short/ bottom stud on the sol.
Then run another from the shortest stud to the + side of the battery. Then run a test light from the longest stud (top) and touch the + side of the battery. When the final connection is made a click should be heard and the test light should come on. If not the sol is need of repair/replacement.
Solenoid test page 5-5 in the fm.
Got to get to work.
Later, nativebroncofan
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  #4  
Old 18th August 2010
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For the run-on starter problem you should remove the solenoid, dismantle it, clean it up inside [it will be filthy in there], and examine the parts. You will probably find the large copper washer and the copper studs to be worn. A kit with replacement parts is available so you do not need a new solenoid.

The kit will probably have a steel washer which is not as good as the original. What i did in one csae was simply flip the original washer over - the other side was still workable.

The Factory Manual contains the test of the coil winding NBF described above. It should pass this test since it is working, just not disengaging. I would do the test before removing the sol, then do it again after re-assembling, before re-installing.
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  #5  
Old 18th August 2010
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Thank you for the welcome, this forum is a valuable resource
Shop was closed for the book but after work today they are open

I will make sure I run the solenoid tests, though I talked to the tech who worked on this bike (he kept callin it a 'shovel'. shovel this shovel that...wtf?) who told me he replaced the solenoid on it.

The solenoid has a rigged up piece of metal on it that hovers over the large contacts that you depress to turn the starter.
Finally got out to ride it a little bit... was acting fine then shut it down and that same starter problem reared its ugly head on start up.

Tests happen today at the end of the work day



nothing you've never seen before.. figured I'd post a picture of what it looks like now before I start replacing parts. Chainguard and front fender are gone for now
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  #6  
Old 18th August 2010
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nativebroncofan nativebroncofan is offline
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That's a sweet looking 79.
don't for get to lightly oil the plunger on that sol when you have it apart.NBF
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Old 3rd September 2010
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learning a new bike is something else..
so after inspecting the primary/starter/solenoid there is some binding and play in the shaft/gear. Is this normal?

Here is a video of both
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Old 3rd September 2010
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I would have to say yeah.
All looked pretty normal to me.
The starter drive gear unit gets held in place by the cover and a copper washer and the seated bearing in the case.
Was there a copper thrust washer on it when you took off the primary cover?
It falls of easy when going back on with the cover.

Some tweek (ever so gently)

the starter gear shift lever (inside of where the video was taken)


I can't remeber if I have or not.
Someone whom has will hopefully find your post.

NBF
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  #9  
Old 3rd September 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aciddeath View Post
learning a new bike is something else..
so after inspecting the primary/starter/solenoid there is some binding and play in the shaft/gear. Is this normal?
Yes, all that is normal. If there were a problem on the primary side, it would most likely be the bendix not meshing with the ring gear.
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  #10  
Old 3rd September 2010
aciddeath aciddeath is offline
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here's a link to the picture of the gasket piece I pulled out of the area just above the bendix gear/solenoid. Someone did a poor job.. who knows what else I will find.

http://i.imgur.com/TmuYg.jpg



The FM sucks at describing the removal of the solenoid. I know there's two bolts, the bottom one looks like I'll have to take off the sprocket cover/rear brake fluid reservoir.

Does the solenoid just slide out then? It is definitely connected to that bendix gear/shaft with a bracket...
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