The Sportster and Buell Motorcycle Forum - The XLFORUM®
 

Go Back   The Sportster and Buell Motorcycle Forum - The XLFORUM® > SPORTSTER MOTORCYCLE FORUM > Sportster Motorcycle Motor / Engine > Sportster Motorcycle - Bottom End
XLF Blogs XLF Arcade XLF Disclaimer/Privacy Statement/Terms Of Use

Sportster Motorcycle - Bottom End Cams, Cases, Gears, Flywheel, Piston Conecting Rods, Oil Pump, etc...

Active Threads
0 Premium vs stock lifters Sportster 48 questions
Last Post: Adam76
Posted On: 3 Minutes Ago
Replies: 48
Views: 1,463
0 '06 Sporster Oil Tank drain
Last Post: Hippysmack
Posted On: 45 Minutes Ago
Replies: 36
Views: 3,962
7 Hello from Pennsylvania
Last Post: Toejam503
Posted On: 49 Minutes Ago
Replies: 1
Views: 10
0 Dual disks and caliper upgrade
Last Post: Toejam503
Posted On: 50 Minutes Ago
Replies: 1
Views: 60
0 Frankenstein trike kit on a sportster
Last Post: doc martin
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 18
Views: 836
0 electrical
Last Post: IXL2Relax
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 9
Views: 2,247
0 No start no click, helppp plz
Last Post: IXL2Relax
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 5
Views: 65
6 Hello from Central Vermont
Last Post: Toejam503
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 10
Views: 121
0 Age limit where belts should be replaced?
Last Post: Toejam503
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 16
Views: 257
0 Do you blip the throttle when downshifting?
Last Post: Kbetts
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 452
Views: 69,111
0 Knocking noise in front cylinder!!!!
Last Post: Gespo2
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 11
Views: 163
0 Need some help
Last Post: IronMick
Posted On: 3 Hours Ago
Replies: 1
Views: 89
0 Operation Live Wire
Last Post: Kbetts
Posted On: 3 Hours Ago
Replies: 40
Views: 3,599
0 Old Parts
Last Post: Bluto
Posted On: 3 Hours Ago
Replies: 8
Views: 235
0 o-ring versus band intakes
Last Post: ryder rick
Posted On: 4 Hours Ago
Replies: 3
Views: 105
0 Nothing much
Last Post: Ferrous Head
Posted On: 4 Hours Ago
Replies: 10
Views: 220
0 91-99 Lifter Pin Upgrade to 00-05 Lifter Pin Screws
Last Post: Hippysmack
Posted On: 5 Hours Ago
Replies: 17
Views: 658
0 So, anyone wanna talk flat track???
Last Post: oupa
Posted On: 5 Hours Ago
Replies: 25
Views: 2,087
0 Hottie of the day, no nudity.
Last Post: trainman
Posted On: 6 Hours Ago
Replies: 9,999
Views: 879,892
0 Hello from Germany
Last Post: sportsterpaul
Posted On: 6 Hours Ago
Replies: 22
Views: 340
5 Harley T-Shirts
Last Post: rejeanprimeau
Posted On: 6 Hours Ago
Replies: 272
Views: 41,766
0 Forum problems???
Last Post: 60Gunner
Posted On: 7 Hours Ago
Replies: 60
Views: 2,598
0 Piston size id?
Last Post: nychopper
Posted On: 7 Hours Ago
Replies: 32
Views: 724
0 Crusty's Travels
Last Post: SonWon
Posted On: 7 Hours Ago
Replies: 1,976
Views: 235,848
0 Official XL Forum Random Image Thread (NO NUDITY!)
Last Post: Graywolf
Posted On: 8 Hours Ago
Replies: 42,870
Views: 6,706,463
0 ....1
Last Post: Graywolf
Posted On: 8 Hours Ago
Replies: 4,791
Views: 270,900
0 Fuel Pump Problems
Last Post: hammer6315
Posted On: 9 Hours Ago
Replies: 257
Views: 144,382
3 Ironhead Pictures Thread
Last Post: Island Dude
Posted On: 9 Hours Ago
Replies: 1,979
Views: 782,774
0 1979 XLH Carb
Last Post: rokytnji
Posted On: 9 Hours Ago
Replies: 7
Views: 137
0 Hello from Murcia-SPAIN
Last Post: rokytnji
Posted On: 9 Hours Ago
Replies: 14
Views: 651
More...
Members Birthdays
stroker ace (79), beunme (59)
Sponsored Links
Reply
 
Share Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10th October 2018
Gary E's Avatar
Gary E Gary E is offline
Drag Race Champion
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Oregon
Posts: 378
Sportster/Buell Model: Flat Track
Sportster/Buell Year: 1989
Other Motorcycle Model: 6 BSA's
Reputation: 149514
Gary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant future
Default Rigid EVO Oil Check Ball & Spring

For the oil filter mount check ball and spring, which installs first, the ball or the spring?

The Parts Catalog for '86-'90 shows the spring first, then the ball, then the oil filter adaptor fitting.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10th October 2018
John Harper John Harper is offline
Master Custom Bike Builder
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 3,142
Sportster/Buell Model: XLH 883
Sportster/Buell Year: 1991
Reputation: 1568114
John Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond repute
Default

That's what my 91 FSM shows too. I think we determined that the checkball actually builds "back pressure" in the filter and housing so the light goes off, then flows into the housing. A member on HDF had a flickering light and we determined the spring was weak, which caused insufficient "back pressure" to trip the oil light. I think it was over on HDF, but it could have been here. It was my theory about the weak spring, and when the guy replaced it the problem was solved. The oil sensor is BEFORE the check ball, not after. That was a big clue to his problem.

John
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10th October 2018
rocketmangb's Avatar
rocketmangb rocketmangb is offline
XL FORUM TEAM MEMBER
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: So Cal
Posts: 20,737
Sportster/Buell Model: XL1200C
Sportster/Buell Year: 2006
Sportster/Buell Model #2: XL1200C
Sportster/Buell Year #2: 2006
Other Motorcycle Model: 48 "Totalled" By a Douche
Other Motorcycle Year: 2012
Reputation: 3486308
rocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Spring then ball for sure
__________________
Thy Sportster Come
It Shall Be Done
On Earth as it is on Salt
2006 Sportster XL1250C
Hammer Sledge Heads 1.98X1.61 Valves
Hammer 600 Cams
Big Ass CP/Hammer Pistons
Mikuni HSR 45 /Hammer Billet Manifold (Now HSR 48)
Jetted 27.5 slow,182.5 Main
97 Needle,Clip posistion 3
Hurricane Flow 3" offset AC,Rocketman Mod
Daytona Twin Tec TC88A,Rico Scarecrow Map
Sumax Thundervolt plug wires,NGK DCPR8EIX spark plugs. Gapped .040 and Indexed
Cycle Electric Stator and Regulator
Alto Carbonite Clutch
Royal Purple 20W50 MC Primary oil
Patriot Defender Pipe
Royal Purple 20W50 MC Engine Oil
Napa 7148 oil filter
Max Power, 111.47
Max Torque, 84.39
Best 1/4 Mile ET to date 11.85
Best 1/4 Speed to date 115.14
Build by Jester Motorwerkz West
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10th October 2018
bustert's Avatar
bustert bustert is offline
XL FORUM TEAM MEMBER
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 8,814
Sportster/Buell Model: 1200s
Sportster/Buell Year: 2001
Sportster/Buell Model #2: xlch
Sportster/Buell Year #2: 1974
Reputation: 1599007
bustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond repute
Default

the spring is to prevent wet sumping, has zero to do with oil pressure. oil pressure is determined by the restriction in the engine. on some models, hd did have a regulator of sorts but it was not designed to block flow, only divert it.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 10th October 2018
John Harper John Harper is offline
Master Custom Bike Builder
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 3,142
Sportster/Buell Model: XLH 883
Sportster/Buell Year: 1991
Reputation: 1568114
John Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond reputeJohn Harper has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bustert View Post
the spring is to prevent wet sumping, has zero to do with oil pressure. oil pressure is determined by the restriction in the engine. on some models, hd did have a regulator of sorts but it was not designed to block flow, only divert it.
Well, when the guy's engine was hot, without enough spring pressure on the ball, the oil light was coming on at idle. Replacing the spring solved the problem. Actually stretching the old spring a bit solved it, but he went and bought a new spring after we figured out what was happening. He had previously paid to have his oil pump replaced, which did not solve the oil light on when hot issue!

You can always test my theory by removing the spring, getting the engine hot and see if the oil light comes on at idle. I wish I could find the guy's post about this issue, you could decide for yourself. Since the pressure sensor is before the check ball, sufficient back pressure must be needed at hot idle to keep the light off. All I know is this solved his problem after trying everything else.

John
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 10th October 2018
Hippysmack's Avatar
Hippysmack Hippysmack is offline
XL FORUM TEAM MEMBER
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 3,701
Sportster/Buell Model: Xl1250S
Sportster/Buell Year: 98
Other Motorcycle Model: Kawasaki Vulcan 500
Other Motorcycle Year: 95
Reputation: 2989465
Hippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bustert View Post
the spring is to prevent wet sumping
This true. The spring pushes the ball to close off oil flow when the engine is not running to stop wet sumping due to gravity of the elevated oil tank.

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Harper View Post
Since the pressure sensor is before the check ball, sufficient back pressure must be needed at hot idle to keep the light off.

John
This is also true.
The back pressure also guards against a condition of some but not enough hot oil getting to the engine.
As in the case of a worn or defective pump as well as deteriorated oil viscosity etc.

The back pressure is however useless on a cold start-up when the oil is thick.

The oil pressure switch is diaphragm operated and the pressure generated by the thick oil trying to pass thru the outlet is greater.
This opens the oil switch contacts apart even though less oil is traveling into the engine at that point.
__________________
Reference the XLFORUM'S Sportsterpedia for additional technical information & advice

In Search of Fuel, Sunshine and a Steady Idle.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 10th October 2018
rocketmangb's Avatar
rocketmangb rocketmangb is offline
XL FORUM TEAM MEMBER
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: So Cal
Posts: 20,737
Sportster/Buell Model: XL1200C
Sportster/Buell Year: 2006
Sportster/Buell Model #2: XL1200C
Sportster/Buell Year #2: 2006
Other Motorcycle Model: 48 "Totalled" By a Douche
Other Motorcycle Year: 2012
Reputation: 3486308
rocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond reputerocketmangb has a reputation beyond repute
Default

There is enough area in the threads above the switch to collect debris and clog or restrict the switch.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 10th October 2018
bustert's Avatar
bustert bustert is offline
XL FORUM TEAM MEMBER
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 8,814
Sportster/Buell Model: 1200s
Sportster/Buell Year: 2001
Sportster/Buell Model #2: xlch
Sportster/Buell Year #2: 1974
Reputation: 1599007
bustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond repute
Default

been there done that and is posted on this forum.
i took a standard spring and measured the coil bind and then did a stretch in stages and posted the increase coil bind pressures and as was expected, it increased, matter of fact, there is science that explains why. but here is an issue that you did not thing of. according to the science of it, you drastically alter the science of the coil tension rate of compression and actually shot yourself in the foot! did you really help the issue, nope! when in operation, the ball IS NOT all the way back, look at how it is installed! it is NOT in a tube so the oil must force it back to open a port, NAW, the ball is open backed so the oil slips around it and probably moves very little off seat, remember, the engine is about volume, not pressure. that said, you actually decrease closing pressure at part opening, remember, the spring is rated 7# at bind not seat.
the fact is, oil pressure is controlled by the restriction of the engine. if you reduce flow rate, you reduce pressure, why, because there is LESS oil trying to force its way through the galleries. would the oil light come on, sure, it does it with the spring/ball in there also.
also of note is if you have a gauge installed, running at idle at temp, would be around 3>5psi, not 7. if the pressure sensor is set at 3, yep, light would probably flicker, death idle is hard mistress. also think of it, if the seat was at 7, then no oil would pass but remember, the seven is bind.

Last edited by bustert; 10th October 2018 at 20:55..
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 10th October 2018
Gary E's Avatar
Gary E Gary E is offline
Drag Race Champion
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Oregon
Posts: 378
Sportster/Buell Model: Flat Track
Sportster/Buell Year: 1989
Other Motorcycle Model: 6 BSA's
Reputation: 149514
Gary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant future
Default

All good information. Thanks fellas. I had replaced the spring and ball with new ones in hope that it would reduce wet sumping. I shall see.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
  #10  
Old 5th November 2018
Gary E's Avatar
Gary E Gary E is offline
Drag Race Champion
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Oregon
Posts: 378
Sportster/Buell Model: Flat Track
Sportster/Buell Year: 1989
Other Motorcycle Model: 6 BSA's
Reputation: 149514
Gary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant futureGary E has a brilliant future
Default

The new ball and spring did not reduce parked wet sumping. It is still about the same, at 3/4 of the tank in 2 weeks.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



Sponsored Links
All times are GMT +1. The time now is 07:25.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
XL Forum® - Linson Media LLC