The Sportster and Buell Motorcycle Forum - The XLFORUM®
 

Go Back   The Sportster and Buell Motorcycle Forum - The XLFORUM® > FORUM FUNCTIONS > Sportsterpedia.com Admin
XLF Blogs XLF Arcade XLF Disclaimer/Privacy Statement/Terms Of Use

Sportsterpedia.com Admin For discussion regarding the administration of the Sportster Wiki.

Active Threads
0 Floating front disc
Last Post: rocketmangb
Posted On: 1 Minute Ago
Replies: 6
Views: 71
0 Keep & Kill
Last Post: Crusty
Posted On: 8 Minutes Ago
Replies: 16,344
Views: 926,985
0 TSM / TSSM / HFSM - How to disable alarm and/or replace unit
Last Post: IXL2Relax
Posted On: 10 Minutes Ago
Replies: 283
Views: 127,206
0 MC lift table modification
Last Post: Hippysmack
Posted On: 33 Minutes Ago
Replies: 2
Views: 14
0 Show us the different versions of your bike!!
Last Post: Mission1
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 187
Views: 69,454
0 Progressive 444s vs Bitubo twin adjustable
Last Post: sml1226
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 9
Views: 123
0 Hottie of the day, no nudity.
Last Post: ronccc
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 17,956
Views: 1,809,627
0 My Rear Master Cylinder Re-build
Last Post: Blackbenny
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 110
Views: 67,061
0 2005 Carburetor Troubleshooting
Last Post: IXL2Relax
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 12
Views: 186
0 Oil change 101 – Engine and Transmission oil change pics
Last Post: glbsportster
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 168
Views: 581,220
0 Need some advice on 1983 Ironhead
Last Post: 83XLX
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 39
Views: 3,091
0 Oil, Filters and Spark Plugs
Last Post: glbsportster
Posted On: 2 Hours Ago
Replies: 108
Views: 7,058
0 Official XL Forum Random Image Thread (NO NUDITY!)
Last Post: hammer6315
Posted On: 2 Hours Ago
Replies: 46,861
Views: 7,461,240
0 What did you do for your sporty Today?
Last Post: hammer6315
Posted On: 2 Hours Ago
Replies: 6,754
Views: 931,364
0 Post up how many wheels you have in your household
Last Post: xraytoken
Posted On: 2 Hours Ago
Replies: 20
Views: 468
0 What kind of saddle do you use on your sporty?
Last Post: duffy
Posted On: 3 Hours Ago
Replies: 285
Views: 83,832
0 MPG HONESTLY, what do you get?
Last Post: glbsportster
Posted On: 3 Hours Ago
Replies: 593
Views: 81,664
0 Poll: Do you change tires yourself?
Last Post: rokytnji
Posted On: 3 Hours Ago
Replies: 130
Views: 33,099
0 My blow through turbo XL1200C
Last Post: thecarnie
Posted On: 3 Hours Ago
Replies: 11
Views: 555
4 greetings from quarantine!
Last Post: sportsterpaul
Posted On: 3 Hours Ago
Replies: 13
Views: 257
0 You asked for it! "The Tess' Coffee Thread"
Last Post: sportsterpaul
Posted On: 3 Hours Ago
Replies: 11,036
Views: 981,400
9 CV carburetor gurus...
Last Post: Dougray
Posted On: 4 Hours Ago
Replies: 14
Views: 307
0 what part numbers do i order if i want a power vision tuner?
Last Post: NGOT8R
Posted On: 4 Hours Ago
Replies: 10
Views: 185
0 Show your favorite pic of your bike. just one
Last Post: 83XLX
Posted On: 4 Hours Ago
Replies: 4,777
Views: 1,849,186
0 1970-71 XL Fuel Tank ?
Last Post: 72 Ironhead XLH
Posted On: 4 Hours Ago
Replies: 8
Views: 181
14 Installed Vulcan 3 Degree Raked Cups
Last Post: kitabel
Posted On: 4 Hours Ago
Replies: 24
Views: 11,118
0 Diagnostic code ?
Last Post: BKB
Posted On: 4 Hours Ago
Replies: 40
Views: 1,553
0 Resto-Repair 84 ironhead
Last Post: ferretface
Posted On: 5 Hours Ago
Replies: 30
Views: 1,695
0 Hot Chicks on Hot Bikes
Last Post: wedge
Posted On: 6 Hours Ago
Replies: 10,701
Views: 1,969,829
0 Corona Virus
Last Post: wedge
Posted On: 6 Hours Ago
Replies: 382
Views: 19,897
More...
Members Birthdays
Reply
 
Share Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Old 21st December 2016
bustert's Avatar
bustert bustert is offline
XL FORUM TEAM MEMBER
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 9,841
Sportster/Buell Model: 1200s
Sportster/Buell Year: 2001
Sportster/Buell Model #2: xlch
Sportster/Buell Year #2: 1974
Reputation: 3014785
bustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond repute
Default

well red is elusive for sure. the first patent issued to him as far as I can tell from brief research was in 1978, pat# 3709469, which was for the electron. he did partnered up with several people and formed multiple companies. the posa, pat# 3957930, was issued to james Birmingham, in collaboration?, who knows.
in around 1947, Ronald gardner was making this style carb and perhaps why red never applied for patent. in his later years, there are many patents.
the lake was never designed for aircraft, the posa factory would modify a unit for that application which for sure included a more secure means of control. his early years may remain a mystery as I believe he past on about 10 years ago or so.
I did run across an interesting factoid and maybe this is where aircraft could have been involved. a similar unit was used but with the aid of compressed air which forced fuel through the unit and helped atomize the fuel. the lake used a tapered needle to try and match fuel delivery (gravity/specific weight and hydro-static head) to a non-linear air delivery.
so I guess you are correct in that there is no smoking gun. not worth the time to look into corporate records even if they exist.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 21st December 2016
bustert's Avatar
bustert bustert is offline
XL FORUM TEAM MEMBER
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 9,841
Sportster/Buell Model: 1200s
Sportster/Buell Year: 2001
Sportster/Buell Model #2: xlch
Sportster/Buell Year #2: 1974
Reputation: 3014785
bustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond repute
Default

well a little more digging:
the patent pending marked on the bodies were probably in relation to application # 7880 on feb 2, 1970 and granted jan 9, 1973. the publication # US3709469A explains the concept.
as was alluded to, red did invent many things but he was not always the one who received the grant as in this case carter carried the assignee. this is not unusual. when working for a company and you invent something, many laws give claim to the company first. my father invented many sub-sea tools used today and received royalities when some one used the tool but he did not own them. so if you invent something, let your wife take claim, hummm, still might get the shaft instead of the gold mine if the marriage goes south.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 22nd December 2016
Hippysmack's Avatar
Hippysmack Hippysmack is offline
XL FORUM TEAM MEMBER
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 5,660
Sportster/Buell Model: Xl1250S
Sportster/Buell Year: 98
Other Motorcycle Model: Kawasaki Vulcan 500
Other Motorcycle Year: 95
Reputation: 5319272
Hippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bustert View Post
well a little more digging:
the patent pending marked on the bodies were probably in relation to application # 7880 on feb 2, 1970 and granted jan 9, 1973. the publication # US3709469A explains the concept.
as was alluded to, red did invent many things but he was not always the one who received the grant as in this case carter carried the assignee. this is not unusual. when working for a company and you invent something, many laws give claim to the company first. my father invented many sub-sea tools used today and received royalities when some one used the tool but he did not own them. so if you invent something, let your wife take claim, hummm, still might get the shaft instead of the gold mine if the marriage goes south.
Sorry, I got tied up in the history section. So, officially, we don't have an origin for the lake? But we know it had at least a brief history in the 70s and noteworthy as such. Can you write an epitaph for me based off your findings and I'll include it?
__________________
Reference the XLFORUM'S Sportsterpedia for additional technical information & advice

In Search of Fuel, Sunshine and a Steady Idle.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 22nd December 2016
bustert's Avatar
bustert bustert is offline
XL FORUM TEAM MEMBER
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 9,841
Sportster/Buell Model: 1200s
Sportster/Buell Year: 2001
Sportster/Buell Model #2: xlch
Sportster/Buell Year #2: 1974
Reputation: 3014785
bustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond reputebustert has a reputation beyond repute
Default

ok, I down loaded the patent in pdf I can send you if I have an address. this is the final grant dated in 1973 but was first applied for back in 1970. of course it probably was proto-typed earlier before the patent was applied for. the final draft was awarded to carter (we know where carter carbs come from) as the assignee but lists ole bill as the inventor.
this falls in line with the lake being a sales item in the media starting in 1973. they did produce the unit before hand and those units were marked patent pending. perhaps it was carter that marketed them and was the assignee, ???. I am assuming they were made on as ordered basic before hand as the lake was an all machined unit, later models that ran off the idea were cast and therefore cheap to make.
http://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j...82524358262201

post#7

Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 29th December 2016
The Doctor71 The Doctor71 is offline
Land Speed Record
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 758
Sportster/Buell Model: xlch
Sportster/Buell Year: 1971
Sportster/Buell Model #2: xlh
Sportster/Buell Year #2: 1974
Other Motorcycle Model: xl1200cp
Other Motorcycle Year: 2011
The Doctor71 has disabled reputation
Default

Hippysmack....

My Tillotson Library --> http://s376.photobucket.com/user/xlc...0-%20Tillotson

My Bendix Zenith Library --> http://s376.photobucket.com/user/xlc...0Zenith%20carb

Not many good shots of the Bendix installed on my '74 XLH. Most are on the bench, when I went thru a rebuild.

Anyway, browse thru my library(s) and pick / discard what you like. If you'd like some better pics of either, I could that too. Just hit me back.

HTH.
Doc71

EDIT: Hippysmack, I'm in the process of trashing my photobucket account, so the links to my photobucket library won't stay live for very much longer.

My updated libraries are now live on Flickr:Let me know if you have trouble accessing those links.

Last edited by The Doctor71; 13th February 2018 at 04:54.. Reason: updated links to pics - trashed PB
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 29th December 2016
Hippysmack's Avatar
Hippysmack Hippysmack is offline
XL FORUM TEAM MEMBER
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 5,660
Sportster/Buell Model: Xl1250S
Sportster/Buell Year: 98
Other Motorcycle Model: Kawasaki Vulcan 500
Other Motorcycle Year: 95
Reputation: 5319272
Hippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Doctor71 View Post
Hippysmack....

My Tillotson Library --> http://s376.photobucket.com/user/xlc...0-%20Tillotson

My Bendix Zenith Library --> http://s376.photobucket.com/user/xlc...0Zenith%20carb

Not many good shots of the Bendix installed on my '74 XLH. Most are on the bench, when I went thru a rebuild.

Anyway, browse thru my library(s) and pick / discard what you like. If you'd like some better pics of either, I could that too. Just hit me back.

HTH.
Doc71
Thank you very, very much sir. I will get them up tomorrow and credit you with the pics.

Wayne
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 29th December 2016
Hippysmack's Avatar
Hippysmack Hippysmack is offline
XL FORUM TEAM MEMBER
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 5,660
Sportster/Buell Model: Xl1250S
Sportster/Buell Year: 98
Other Motorcycle Model: Kawasaki Vulcan 500
Other Motorcycle Year: 95
Reputation: 5319272
Hippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Doctor71 View Post
Hippysmack....

My Tillotson Library --> http://s376.photobucket.com/user/xlc...0-%20Tillotson

My Bendix Zenith Library --> http://s376.photobucket.com/user/xlc...0Zenith%20carb
HTH.
Doc71
They are up. I hope I did them justice.
Thanks again for your help and support.
http://sportsterpedia.com/doku.php/h...arburetor_pics
scroll down for the Bendix/Zenith pics
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 30th December 2016
The Doctor71 The Doctor71 is offline
Land Speed Record
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 758
Sportster/Buell Model: xlch
Sportster/Buell Year: 1971
Sportster/Buell Model #2: xlh
Sportster/Buell Year #2: 1974
Other Motorcycle Model: xl1200cp
Other Motorcycle Year: 2011
The Doctor71 has disabled reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hippysmack View Post
They are up. I hope I did them justice.
Thanks again for your help and support.
http://sportsterpedia.com/doku.php/h...arburetor_pics
scroll down for the Bendix/Zenith pics
Cool. My pleasure.

Sorta wish I had some better pictures of the carbs installed, rather than in various stages of re-build..... and the junk on my bench in my background doesn't help. Let me see what I can do over the next week. I'll get back to you.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 30th December 2016
Hippysmack's Avatar
Hippysmack Hippysmack is offline
XL FORUM TEAM MEMBER
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 5,660
Sportster/Buell Model: Xl1250S
Sportster/Buell Year: 98
Other Motorcycle Model: Kawasaki Vulcan 500
Other Motorcycle Year: 95
Reputation: 5319272
Hippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond reputeHippysmack has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Doctor71 View Post
Cool. My pleasure.

Sorta wish I had some better pictures of the carbs installed, rather than in various stages of re-build..... and the junk on my bench in my background doesn't help. Let me see what I can do over the next week. I'll get back to you.
I actually like the shop looking like it's actually used to build things. Squeeky clean shop pics make you wonder what the shop is actually use for. I'm open to however you want to present them. Thanks for your help. Good way to show how to hold a carb up for rebuilding too.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 05:50.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
XL Forum® - Linson Media LLC