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  #51  
Old 1st June 2020
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Just asking questions to try and learn something from those that know more on the subject than I do, because I know what words start and finish "assume".

If...
Quote:
Originally Posted by aswracing View Post


Look closely at the shape of the torque curve, it tells the story. A torque curve is effectively a map of the cylinder fill. The unbaffled pipe is pulling real hard at 5800 and falling off sharply on either side of that. That's what a straight, open pipe does, it pulls hard at one rpm only. You can easily move that peak to the left by making the pipe longer or to the right by making the pipe shorter.
And...
Quote:
Originally Posted by aswracing View Post
Now stick a baffle in it and see what happens:



The torque peak moved down the rpm scale and is now coming in at about 5200rpm instead. The peak isn't as high, and the torque is spread out some as well, not falling off so badly on either side. This is what diffusion does. Instead of a pull that's concentrated at one rpm, you spread it out, which of course results in a more spread out torque curve, which of course means a wider powerband.
Would that mean you could move that spread out torque curve further left by making the pipe longer and using the baffles?

If so, is there a formula for figuring out how much longer, and/or where the baffles needed to be placed in the pipe?
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  #52  
Old 2nd June 2020
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Yes.

Losing alot of low/midrange torque without the baffles and a some pretty good reversion in an rpm range I wouldn't want it. With the baffles it's at 2500. No big deal.
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  #53  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rocketmangb View Post
Sorry Seajay
I dynoed one on my Stage I
Side Shots beat it easily
Side Shots, Short Shots, Big Radius etc. always seem to get a bad rap, as per the subject of this thread, they are pretty good exhaust, for an Evo Sportster stage 1 particularly.

As far as available 2to1 pipes on a Sportster I would say the LSR would be as good as or better than other available pipes (they have several models, you don't mention what you tried), with the Patriot now gone, particularly if you want the sound. Personally I lean toward the Cobra's for 2to1 for a Sportster, just prefer the sound, but, I'll most likely be keeping the Short Shots anyway, I have some TTIs to put in when I pull the baffles, from DK Customs Dyno Charts it seems they do a great job of keep the low end torque and the top end power from no baffles and sound great. It would be interesting to see some updated comparisons against AVAILABLE exhaust options.

Don't know why all the ranting on about the Patriot, they stopped making them for a reason I would think, I guess you could try mounting Unicorns for an exhaust.

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  #54  
Old 3rd June 2020
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SLW210 View Post
Side Shots, Short Shots, Big Radius etc. always seem to get a bad rap, as per the subject of this thread, they are pretty good exhaust, for an Evo Sportster stage 1 particularly.

As far as available 2to1 pipes on a Sportster I would say the LSR would be as good as or better than other available pipes (they have several models, you don't mention what you tried), with the Patriot now gone, particularly if you want the sound. Personally I lean toward the Cobra's for 2to1 for a Sportster, just prefer the sound, but, I'll most likely be keeping the Short Shots anyway, I have some TTIs to put in when I pull the baffles, from DK Customs Dyno Charts it seems they do a great job of keep the low end torque and the top end power from no baffles and sound great. It would be interesting to see some updated comparisons against AVAILABLE exhaust options.

Don't know why all the ranting on about the Patriot, they stopped making them for a reason I would think, I guess you could try mounting Unicorns for an exhaust.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLORhshZcDc
Benchmarking is the simple answer as to why it is continued to be used as the comparison for performance evaluations of other pipes. Hammer chose this as the comparison pipe as it was the best performing mass-produced pipe they had found in terms of horsepower at high rpm. They keep hoping to beat it.

And Yes, the Patriots are now unicorns... but it still serves as a good benchmark to get an idea of relative performance. And certainly, we are not all solely interested in performance at higher RPMs... my personal preferences were for clearance, looks and power curve behaviour and I chose to change from the Short Shots to a Bobcat. But it was awesome to be able to use Hammer's comparisons against the benchmark to help me with my research. Of course, if my list of personal preferences did not include power curve behaviour, but were more based on looks and sound to personalize my ride then there'd be no need to be worried reading these power-based evaluations and comparisons.
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  #55  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sportytrace View Post
And Yes, the Patriots are now unicorns... but it still serves as a good benchmark to get an idea of relative performance. And certainly, we are not all solely interested in performance at higher RPMs... my personal preferences were for clearance, looks and power curve behaviour and I chose to change from the Short Shots to a Bobcat. But it was awesome to be able to use Hammer's comparisons against the benchmark to help me with my research. Of course, if my list of personal preferences did not include power curve behaviour, but were more based on looks and sound to personalize my ride then there'd be no need to be worried reading these power-based evaluations and comparisons.
Exactly!

And the main reason I asked my question above is because I'm looking for the compromise I want, which includes all of the things you listed plus looks and sound, though maybe in slightly different proportions and a bit different criteria than you were looking for. I've pretty much concluded that nobody builds what I want anymore, so I might have to build it myself. (Unless I can find my unicorn, which is apparently just as rare as the Patriots.) But before I start building the pipe, I want to have a little idea of what I'm doing so I don't wind up with a new record worst pipe. The Short Shots could be a very good starting point for the pipes I want, as the front 3/4 of them are exactly the shape I want. I just want to have some idea how the rest of my "pipe dream" is going to work out, or if it isn't, before I go shelling out a lot of time and energy on something that ain't gonna work.
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  #56  
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  #57  
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For anyone who doesn't approve of the tests or how they were done, I offer double your money back

That's the second best double back guarantee I've heard.

My local trash company guarantees satisfaction or double your trash back.
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