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Sportster Motorcycle Motor - Top End Discuss Sportster Motorcycle Top End issues. Rockerboxes, Valves, Cylinders, Pistons, Rings, Lift Rods, etc...

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  #41  
Old 27th October 2020
Jonzilla Jonzilla is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IXL2Relax View Post
Those videos are much better - I can definitely hear the knock in the cold version...

SO - Are you using the stock 883 ignition module?

If yes, all the HD modules were prone to heat failure. They would fail in various ways, but improper timing was certainly one of the ways...

Here's a test for you to do --- when the engine is cold (like overnight), remove the nosecone cover and preheat the ignition module with a hair dryer - once the module itself is warmed up, then start the cold engine (with the enrichener) and see if the knock is still there...

In fact, you could do the same test to the coil...

Most times, the ignition module or coil will fail after being heated up - but I can imagine the reverse condition also happening...

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I am still running the 883 ignition, slightly retarded. I have a new Daytona Twin Tec 1005S-EX in the box to install when I get time.

I will try to reheat my ignition module though, to see if that has any effect. And do the same to my coil on a different cold start. Good idea.
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  #42  
Old 27th October 2020
Jonzilla Jonzilla is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hippysmack View Post
The noise is still there when hot.
I don't here it from the right side when hot but I do in the left side when hot.
It may just be in the primary compartment.

Do you have a 2x4 or wooden handle you can stick one end around different spots on the primary cover and the other to your ear?


I've got a mechanic's stethoscope I've been using to zero in on where the noise is located. With the engine cold, I can hear it loud and clear in the mid to upper cylinder area and on the exhaust flange. No noises in the primary area. I have checked my primary change tension and it is in spec. I agree though, the noise is still faintly there and can be heard on the left side more than the right. I've never pulled the primary cover on this bike so it is worth a look...
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  #43  
Old 27th October 2020
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Noises in a Sportster transfer thru other areas from the source.
That's one reason it's difficult sometimes to find them.
I have no idea where it is coming from but it helped when you panned the camera to the left side.
Primary noises can end up resonating in the cylinders or rocker boxes.
Tapping noises that really sound like lifter noises sometimes are really in the boxes.
That's why critical listening is so important.
Testing one spot anywhere and declaring that area not to be the problem doesn't help you find the noise.
I have chased noises for a while with the stick only to realize, nope wrong again.
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  #44  
Old 27th October 2020
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been busy but i think some of the members here have some excellent ideas.
i myself would suspect guide issue, why??? well you said it ran rich so fuel will wash off the oil film, remember, the guide seal does not prevent oiling only controls it. i would pull the head and remove the valves and look at the bore and stem and measure clearance. i too had issues with bronze guides which are supposed to be slippery than steel guides and probably was so in the beginning but as time wore on, had some issues so went back to steel or powder iron guides.
the sportster oiling to the top end sometimes takes a few minutes, they do make better lifters. some even claim chevy lifters does wonders but i am not buying that. did you install new seals??? might not be doing its job till it is flooded with oil.
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  #45  
Old 4 Weeks Ago
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hippysmack View Post
Noises in a Sportster transfer thru other areas from the source.
That's one reason it's difficult sometimes to find them.
I have no idea where it is coming from but it helped when you panned the camera to the left side.
Primary noises can end up resonating in the cylinders or rocker boxes.
Tapping noises that really sound like lifter noises sometimes are really in the boxes.
That's why critical listening is so important.
Testing one spot anywhere and declaring that area not to be the problem doesn't help you find the noise.
I have chased noises for a while with the stick only to realize, nope wrong again.
I have definitely listened to probably every square inch on this bike with the stethoscope to see where the racket is coming from. I don't hear anything unusual anywhere except the mid to upper cylinder and on the exhaust flange too. I figure that even if a noise can resonate to different areas, I would still hear the noise where it is resonating from, too. Maybe I'm wrong. As they say, it wouldn't be the first time! I'll keep noise chasing until I figure it out.
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  #46  
Old 4 Weeks Ago
Jonzilla Jonzilla is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bustert View Post
been busy but i think some of the members here have some excellent ideas.
i myself would suspect guide issue, why??? well you said it ran rich so fuel will wash off the oil film, remember, the guide seal does not prevent oiling only controls it. i would pull the head and remove the valves and look at the bore and stem and measure clearance. i too had issues with bronze guides which are supposed to be slippery than steel guides and probably was so in the beginning but as time wore on, had some issues so went back to steel or powder iron guides.
the sportster oiling to the top end sometimes takes a few minutes, they do make better lifters. some even claim chevy lifters does wonders but i am not buying that. did you install new seals??? might not be doing its job till it is flooded with oil.
The bike was running very very rich when I first bought it in the Spring and before my rebuild. Like so rich that it would immediately fire up with no choke and just idle right away on a cold engine. I rebuilt the carb and got that straightened out a while ago.

When I did the rebuild I disassembled my heads and lapped the valves. I replaced the seals with the ones in my Cometic gasket set. Not sure if I mentioned it but I also installed some S&S lifters. I did not measure the valve guides I just cleaned the crud off of everything and oiled the valve stems when I reassembled everything.

You think maybe the valve stem is rattling around in a possibly worn guide? Is that what you're saying? I'm getting pretty good at taking this thing apart and putting it back together again
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  #47  
Old 4 Weeks Ago
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naw, even if the valve stuck a little, enough to make noise.
expounding on past issue. this would not happen everytime but when it did, with a manual foot it is a bummer. what would happen is the valve would hang even ever so little and on a kick, it would free wheel to the next cyl compression and then roll back, a bummer with a dropped foot. sometimes it would do it several times and sometimes not, never knew. this was on a solid lifter setup.
i run s&s lifter spacers on my 01 sport and yep, it will tick on start up till oil gets moving around but my travel is only .008>.010 just enough to quieten the valve train so basically solid on a hyd grind cam. s&s makes several lifters so which ones.
when i installed the spacers, it rattled like a chinaman in a bucket with a spoon for about five miles. i run adjustable p/r's, but do you have the correct rods per hole???
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  #48  
Old 4 Weeks Ago
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Hippysmack Hippysmack is offline
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OK.
I didn't know the extent of where and how much you've searched.
If you've ruled out the pistons/rods/cylinders/valves upon inspection, then its gotsta be lower.
I don't think it's suppose to do that so something isn't right.
It gets softer after the oil heats up. That says something.

When I did my conversion and removed the wrist pins, I noticed that the upper rod bushing on one cyl didn't quite look right.
It wasn't scored or with heat marks.
So just to set my mind at ease, I mic'd it with a bore gauge to find it was no longer round (egg shaped).
Seemed like it was a very small measurement (maybe a thousand or two?).
So it wasn't very obvious but just made me go hhhhmmm.
That translates into up and down slop. Didn't scar the cylinder... but didn't sound like yours either.

I can't find the picture I took back then but these show the rod (left in pic) after I installed new bushings.
The bushing is round in this pic.
But what I realized was the rod bore itself was egg shaped after removing the bushing.
That you can vaguely see in the pic below. The gap on the outside of the bushing (top part).


Last edited by Hippysmack; 4 Weeks Ago at 03:50..
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