The Sportster and Buell Motorcycle Forum - The XLFORUM®
 

Go Back   The Sportster and Buell Motorcycle Forum - The XLFORUM® > SPORTSTER MOTORCYCLE FORUM > Sportster Motorcycle Era Specific and Model Specific > Ironhead Sportster Motorcycle Talk (1957-1985)
XLF Blogs XLF Arcade XLF Disclaimer/Privacy Statement/Terms Of Use

Notices

Ironhead Sportster Motorcycle Talk (1957-1985) For all those that wanna talk about Ironhead Sportster Motorcycles

Active Threads
0 a definitive sportster chain conversion pros and cons list
Last Post: adri
Posted On: 20 Minutes Ago
Replies: 30
Views: 1,524
0 The Strociek Project
Last Post: Chuckthebeatertruck
Posted On: 48 Minutes Ago
Replies: 71
Views: 5,073
5 Thunderstorm pistons in xl??
Last Post: Tomcatt
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 2
Views: 94
0 Crankcase drain
Last Post: Mike1nw
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 0
Views: 18
0 sportster revival
Last Post: brucstoudt
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 12
Views: 424
0 Official XL Forum Random Image Thread (NO NUDITY!)
Last Post: Fivecats
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 52,579
Views: 8,875,868
0 Q cams in 73 xlh ??
Last Post: 73HEAD
Posted On: 1 Hour Ago
Replies: 82
Views: 5,708
0 71 XLH Value?
Last Post: brucstoudt
Posted On: 2 Hours Ago
Replies: 60
Views: 2,117
0 Trouble removing old license plate
Last Post: rejeanprimeau
Posted On: 2 Hours Ago
Replies: 7
Views: 567
0 Snippets
Last Post: BKB
Posted On: 3 Hours Ago
Replies: 535
Views: 74,979
0 Keep & Kill
Last Post: Crusty
Posted On: 4 Hours Ago
Replies: 25,652
Views: 1,501,902
0 Posting Pics
Last Post: BigAl57
Posted On: 4 Hours Ago
Replies: 16
Views: 6,496
7 2001 xlh 1200 off road
Last Post: Warlock
Posted On: 9 Hours Ago
Replies: 5
Views: 1,153
0 Hot Rods, Rat Rods, and Customs.
Last Post: Graywolf
Posted On: 10 Hours Ago
Replies: 4,826
Views: 962,744
0 Allegheny National Park III
Last Post: BKB
Posted On: 10 Hours Ago
Replies: 51
Views: 1,510
0 Hello From Brighton, England
Last Post: ChinCactus
Posted On: 11 Hours Ago
Replies: 10
Views: 115
9 Very long pullback handlebars required
Last Post: Elzer0
Posted On: 12 Hours Ago
Replies: 15
Views: 1,375
0 Japanese Cush Drive!!
Last Post: SonWon
Posted On: 12 Hours Ago
Replies: 49
Views: 17,540
0 Hottie of the day, no nudity.
Last Post: cal43
Posted On: 14 Hours Ago
Replies: 33,159
Views: 3,916,611
0 video & pics
Last Post: cal43
Posted On: 14 Hours Ago
Replies: 598
Views: 64,093
0 This is gonna hurt.
Last Post: cal43
Posted On: 15 Hours Ago
Replies: 9,094
Views: 2,133,893
0 Hot Chicks on Hot Bikes
Last Post: cal43
Posted On: 16 Hours Ago
Replies: 12,619
Views: 2,996,147
0 Electrical Harness Replacemet vs. Self Rewire
Last Post: IXL2Relax
Posted On: 21 Hours Ago
Replies: 31
Views: 8,236
0 04 Sportster refurb and build.
Last Post: sportsterpaul
Posted On: 21 Hours Ago
Replies: 39
Views: 2,943
0 never mind
Last Post: IXL2Relax
Posted On: 21 Hours Ago
Replies: 303
Views: 58,819
0 Canadian Purchases
Last Post: XL Ed
Posted On: 22 Hours Ago
Replies: 22
Views: 4,015
0 Looking for community help/steering/front end issues
Last Post: rejeanprimeau
Posted On: 1 Day Ago
Replies: 5
Views: 179
0 best set up for ease of kick starting
Last Post: Ferrous Head
Posted On: 1 Day Ago
Replies: 4
Views: 398
0 2007 Sportster 883 won’t start; no turn signals
Last Post: IXL2Relax
Posted On: 1 Day Ago
Replies: 9
Views: 324
More...
Members Birthdays
Reply
 
Share Thread Tools Display Modes
  #81  
Old 13th December 2014
Chuckthebeatertruck's Avatar
Chuckthebeatertruck Chuckthebeatertruck is offline
Custom Bike Builder
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 2,402
Sportster/Buell Model: Xlh
Sportster/Buell Year: 1959
Sportster/Buell Model #2: Sprint 350
Sportster/Buell Year #2: 1969
Other Motorcycle Model: Guzzi Ambassador
Other Motorcycle Year: 1969
Reputation: 1110836
Chuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DR DICK View Post
if you read up you will find that stiff, lightweight cages with narrow roller guide contact are preferred by the engineers. especially in stokers where the rod angle cycling is greater.
(whats not commonly discussed is how much the precision of cage manufacture influences lower end life. my experience dictates precision is way more important than mass.)

this steel cage failure is due to factors that can easily be checked.
in order to recognize those factors a wrench need to understand why some steel cages last 100yrs and some last 100 days.
that understanding is gained thru lots of observation and deduction.

any 2 pc closed end cage failure WILL destroy your big end regardless of mileage from build date.

cages are THE item when it come to how long a correctly assembled big end stays together and how many rpms it can endure.

lightened, scarfed, and relived steel cages are all i use in my own motors.
but
it takes me 40 yrs of involvement and 10 hrs of constant work to select and prep one set.
would you fork over $600 for cages?
your not alone, ive never met anyone else who would either.

if your not equipped to correctly rebuild rod sets with your own skills use the cages your builder recommends.
----------------------------------------------
a careful read of this post and some serious thought will discover all my hard won, real life, understanding of cages so far.

Well put! i agree, pay for the best knowledge you can afford when you've hit your skill or comfort level. i knew better than to make this my first ironhead bottom end. I'm real familiar with several types of motors, but not ironheads, so off to the shilled people several bits go!
Now, on the fun side, all my Andrews gears arrived yesterday! I was like a kid at Christmas. Clunky old worn out trans will soon be back to a nice slick shifting unit. I'll post photos of some of the fears, they are in less then stellar shape like the crank pin!
Reply With Quote
  #82  
Old 18th December 2014
Chuckthebeatertruck's Avatar
Chuckthebeatertruck Chuckthebeatertruck is offline
Custom Bike Builder
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 2,402
Sportster/Buell Model: Xlh
Sportster/Buell Year: 1959
Sportster/Buell Model #2: Sprint 350
Sportster/Buell Year #2: 1969
Other Motorcycle Model: Guzzi Ambassador
Other Motorcycle Year: 1969
Reputation: 1110836
Chuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Well, the Andrews love affair continues. I stumbled on a brand new set of PB+ cams for a whopping $170. I figured with a rebuilt bottom end, rebuilt trans, new rings and a valve job that I might as well give the old girl a bit of grunt. I'm not actually after a bunch of power, but for 170 bucks I'll give them a shot. Carb is still a dc so that will limit gains considerably.

As soon as I get my hardware back from the cad platers it will be time to start reassembling the motor. Yippee!
Reply With Quote
  #83  
Old 22nd December 2014
Chuckthebeatertruck's Avatar
Chuckthebeatertruck Chuckthebeatertruck is offline
Custom Bike Builder
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 2,402
Sportster/Buell Model: Xlh
Sportster/Buell Year: 1959
Sportster/Buell Model #2: Sprint 350
Sportster/Buell Year #2: 1969
Other Motorcycle Model: Guzzi Ambassador
Other Motorcycle Year: 1969
Reputation: 1110836
Chuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond repute
Default

This week: Timken race installation, painting cylinders, and transmission disassembly!

First, the good news. A new toy arrived in the shop this week – a 20 ton HF shop press. For years, I’ve been heating/freezing parts and using an oversized vice to press things in and out – or worse a BF Hammer. I’ve also got a buddy just down the road with a “real” shop . . . but I hate calling on him all the time.



Given the number of press fit parts on both the Sporty AND all my other bikes/cars; I figured it was time to buy my own press. It was on super sale for $139; and with a 25% off coupon – it was $105. Can’t beat that.

Saturday morning I woke up early and tossed the new Timken cage into the freezer and got to scrubbing the engine cases SUPER clean in the sink (I have a forgiving wife). No sense stinking up the house when I bake the left side in the oven. What, you say, why would you bake the case half?

While you can heat up a case with a propane torch to easily get out a bearing race, it’s a lot easier to bring the whole thing up to temperature. Tossing it in the oven for an hour at 300 degrees works miracles. So, in it went.

While I was waiting, I decided to hone the cylinders and coat them with paint stripper. 30 minutes later, the old, thick black paint came right off. By the time I was done washing the cylinders in hot water and simple green, the left case was up to temperature. So, the cylinders and heads went into the oven to dry fast (helps prevent flash rust) and the case came out.

Walk out to the shop with the new bearing race in my pocket. Grab a 36mm socket line it all up and two minutes later the old race is out. I popped the inner lock ring in place, grabbed the cold bearing race and a FLAT piece of ¼ inch plate steel. The race slipped about half way home with very light pressure. Put the plate on top and pressed it flat to ensure it was square in the bore before I pressed it the rest of the way. Back to the 36mm socket. 30 seconds later I feel just a touch of resistance. Flip it over and the race is nice and snug against the inner lock ring. Job done. Soooooooooooooo much easier with my own press. Totally worth $105.

Here’s a shot of the “old” Timken race. You can see the nice even wear band and the “line” the cracked cage was starting to dig into the race. A few more hundred miles and the damage would have been GREAT.





About now, my cylinders were dry. So, back into the house for a quick minute. I used the 8 inch wire brush and a 5 inch nylon brush to clean up the fins and other bits. Quick spray with prep spray for a final degreasing and we’re ready to paint. By now, the cast iron is down to about 90-95 degrees and the Silver engine enamel is sitting in a bucket of 100 degree water. 2 light tack coats and one medium coat later, and were done. 10 minutes of flash and I carefully picked all the parts up and carried them back in the house. With the oven set at 200 degrees, I let them bake for another 90 minutes and then cool over night. Did I mention I have a forgiving wife?



They came out really well . . . in fact, better then expected.

With the cylinders and heads baking away – I decided to strip the trans and give it a once over. Here’s what I found. First, the trapdoor big bearing is about dead. Lots of up/down play. The needle bearings are about ¾ gone. I’ll likely replace all of them together. Strangely, the 23 rollers are sized correctly – dead on at .001 clearance.

The gears themselves are all worn. I did find the lovely, and proverbial, cracks on both of the 20 tooth gears. Here’s a photo of the most “obvious” crack.



For those of you having trouble seeing it, look between 12 and 1 o'clock. See that dark, scragle of a line -- that's a crack. And deep enough to catch a finger nail.

A time bomb, to say the least. None of the other gears had cracks, but all showed a fairly hard life, with some potential cracks on the female ends of 3rd and 2nd. I'd have to magnaflux to be sure; but I've got new gears and therefore, won't bother.

Main and counter shafts are both straight and in pretty good shape. Some normal wear; but nothing that really got my attention. All the splines are nice and even.

Now, however, I need some opinions/help from the more experienced. First, my shift forks. Here are front and back pictures of the forks. The wear is nearly identical on both parts and they are flat. Top hats show little wear and the inside of the crescent shows no wear. It does not appear the gears were riding the forks due to the dogs slipping. Thoughts on reuse (provided everything shims up correctly)? Normally, I’d reuse these forks, but want to ask those with more experience.











Clutch gear. The teeth show normal wear, but no pits or cracks. It was a nice tight fit in the bearing (thanks again, shop press!). But, look at the dogs. They are slightly rounded on the left side shoulder, with one of the four having a decent beating on it. There are no chips, just rounding. Thoughts on reuse? The only reason I’m leaning towards reuse is that I’ve struck out finding NOS, and the only readily available ones are Vtwin – which I’m very hesitant to use.











Then, there’s 1st. I do want to run my speedo; so keeping this style gear is a must for me. At first glance, I thought it was OK; but then I flipped it over and looked at the dogs. Look at the 11 oclock position and you’ll see the worst of the dogs. It’s more rounded over then I’m used to seeing for a first gear. The other three show rounding, but not to this extent. Again, thoughts on reuse? The only NOS I’ve found are AMF era. I know quality was iffy during that time frame – so advice is welcome.







Otherwise, I’ve got complete Andrews for the other 6 gears
Reply With Quote
  #84  
Old 5th January 2015
Chuckthebeatertruck's Avatar
Chuckthebeatertruck Chuckthebeatertruck is offline
Custom Bike Builder
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 2,402
Sportster/Buell Model: Xlh
Sportster/Buell Year: 1959
Sportster/Buell Model #2: Sprint 350
Sportster/Buell Year #2: 1969
Other Motorcycle Model: Guzzi Ambassador
Other Motorcycle Year: 1969
Reputation: 1110836
Chuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond repute
Default

The last two weeks saw me mostly at home for the holidays and catching a few hours in the shop when I could. The “big” task for the holidays was polishing all of the aluminum. Sometime in the past, a PO did a pretty poor job of sanding the cast aluminum bits and polishing them. The parts were no longer sand cast, but they weren’t polished either. As a result, they took on a pretty crusty patina.

I wound up having to sand them with 80 grit paper just to remove the remaining sand cast marks and a bunch of pits/scratches. Some pits were too deep for removal without serious grinding, so they got left. After the 80, it was up through the range to 400 – followed by emery paste, Tripoli, and white rouge. Final result is NOT show polishing, but a nice clean finish. I love show polish jobs; but after paying through the nose once and realizing that I f’ed it all up after the first year of riding more than washing; I settled on nicer than factory. All in all 22 hours of labor for a handful of parts.

After that, I turned my attention back to different subsystems of the bike. I started with the heads. Valve seats got a fresh 45 and 30 degree cut (thanks to a darn well brand new Sioux valve cutting set I found at an antique store!), followed by a light lapping. Poured alcohol in the intake and exhaust – no leaks! Yippee. Reassembled the rocker boxes and called it a day.

The next day, I finished checking the gaps on the piston rings, and the final fit of everything after a light honing. Ring gap is on the high end at .025; but given the expansion rate of these old low silicone forged pistons, I’m OK with that.

My new Andrews Cams arrived just after Christmas and I spent some time dialing them in. It helped to have a nice new gasket and fresh cad hardware from colony. As they came out of the box, end play ranged from .042 to .058. So, a 10-pack of .015 shims are on their way. For those of you that care about these things, Andrews revised its instruction sheets. The old set followed the FSM and called for end play of .001-.006. The new set calls for end play of .010-.020.

I also measured all the cam chest bushings and torringtons. All were dead on in the middle of the spec; except the pinion bush. It was .003 out of the max spec and a new one is on order. Gives me an excuse to use that 5/8ths hone I’ve had sitting around.

With all that done, it was time to read as many transmission posts as possible – big thanks to Dr. Dick for all he posted on this subject over the years. Four hours later, I walked out the shop, pressed in all the new trap door bearings (and the case closed end bearing) and brought everything inside the house so the better half could keep an eye on me. I had previously examined my gears and forks – ordering Andrews replacements. In the end, 2nd and 3rd were either cracked or the dogs worn, cs 1st had seriously rounded dogs, and while I was at it, I replaced cs 4th as well. The only gear that didn’t get replaced was the clutch gear. After cleaning it and comparing it to new dogs, the wear was not as bad as I thought on first blush. For those of you wondering, the cs 1st is not made by Andrews for the early bikes, so I had to go NOS.

The trans went together smoothly and the gaps were nice on the ms, but terrible on the cs. In fact, they were so terrible that cs 1st was engaged .030 in neutral! I pulled everything apart to check I put in the thrust washers, and yep, all was well. WTF? I went outside and grabbed my old 1st – it fit great with a .039 gap. OK, we’ve got a serious issue if we go from .030 interference to .039 clear.

I pulled out my trustee calipers and began measuring. First, the NOS gear measures in at 1.455 overall height (gear to dogs) and the original gear at 1.501. Hmm, that’s interesting. I take a look at the box – you guessed it, AMF era. OK, let’s look at the depth from the dogs to the bushing. Turns out the NOS gear allows the gear to sit .074 closer to the trap door; hence the interference (remember, our difference was .069).

Alright, now that I figured that mess out, I can actually start spacing out the cs gears. Turns out I need a +.020 shift fork and TWO .065 thrust washers under the cs 1st. This will give me even gaps of .049 and .051. What’s interesting is that the later bikes use two thrust washers, but the early bikes only use one. I almost wonder if AMF somehow screwed up the specs on the NOS gear with this in mind. In any case, Unless I custom grind a thrust washer, I don’t have much choice. The thickest I can get is .10. My two .065 equal .130; a difference of .030; if I went with just the single washer, my gap would shrink from .051 to .021; which is a bit too tight. After an hour of math; I decided to have a beer and smile. The whole process of sorting out the cs 1st reminded of Dirty Cory’s transmission rebuild and the modification he had to make to a gear to get it all to fit right.

All that said, the Andrews gears are quite lovely – everything “snaps” nicely into place as you cycle through the gears – even with the spacing all off. I’m looking forward to getting it all dialed in.

With a bit of luck, my hardware and other parts will come back from cad plating this week and I can start reassembling the bottom end over the weekend. With a bit more luck, I may actually have the motor back together and in the frame over MLK weekend.
Reply With Quote
  #85  
Old 12th January 2015
Chuckthebeatertruck's Avatar
Chuckthebeatertruck Chuckthebeatertruck is offline
Custom Bike Builder
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 2,402
Sportster/Buell Model: Xlh
Sportster/Buell Year: 1959
Sportster/Buell Model #2: Sprint 350
Sportster/Buell Year #2: 1969
Other Motorcycle Model: Guzzi Ambassador
Other Motorcycle Year: 1969
Reputation: 1110836
Chuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond repute
Default

My big parts orders arrived this week and I was able to get to work finishing up some sub-assemblies on the motor/trans.

First order of business was getting the old, worn out pinion bush out of the cam chest. I had to heat it to about 300 degrees and use a blind bearing puller to get it out without drama. Once the cam cover was up to temperature, it slipped right out with just a bit of work.

I cleaned up the cover with some alcohol and it dried nearly instantly. Working quick I smeared a bit of Loctite on the bush and in it went without drama. It helped that the bush had been sitting in the unheated shop during some of the coldest days this year!

Using a tip from Dr. Dick, I carefully drilled and tapped the bush/cam cover for a 6-32 set screw. I used a brand new HSS drill bit and tap. It went very smoothly. In went the set screw with a touch of Loctite, and a quick peen of the bush ensures it won’t come out anytime soon. The photo is of the bush set in the bore and drilled/tapped – but no set screw.



With that done, I moved on to reaming the bush. A 5/8 reamer cleaned it up with minimum fuss. Carefully cleaned out the swarf and blew all the holes clear with 150 psi. Did a trial fit with pinion – like butter. Yippee.

So, we moved on to finishing the cam shimming.



A nice new cam chest gasket and the right .015 shims had me dialed in with speed. Cams are at .011, .015, .014, and .011. Andrews calls for .010-.020. So, we’re in the ball park.

I figured I was having a great shimming day and finished up the trans as well. New shims and shift fork got all of the gaps lovely at .041-.045. Shifting was really nice on the bench with each gear snicking into place with a lovely click. The gears feel great in each gear – it should be a really nice trans when all is said and done.





With that done, I turned my attention to the pistons. I received a new wrist pin for the mostly destroyed one on the front cylinder. Problem is that it weighs eight grams more than the old one and the total weight of the pistons/rings/circlips/pins between the front and rear cylinder was off by 8.9 grams. The max I'll accept for a twin is 3 grams and I prefer to be less than 1 gram. So, it was time to put the front cylinder on some weight loss. Flipping over the piston, I milled two spots out of the underside of the crown. This took 4 grams out of the piston and still left me with .215 crown thickness -- plenty on a forged piston. I've gone as thin as .190; but didn't really want to do that with these "vintage" replacements. I was able to get another 1.9 grams out by carefully milling and filling the skirt. So, we got within three grams between the two assemblies. Not perfect, but acceptable.

Finally, I got my tires and tubes. I’m currently caring for 5 bikes, four of which have spoked rims and tubes. I also take care of a few bikes for buddies – so I change a fair amount of tires. I finally got smart and bought one of those 7 buck cables that screw into the tube and help you pull the valve stem through the rim. Suddenly, I wasn’t cursing anymore. It just popped in. I also bought two new steel spoons with a slightly more ergonomic design. Together with my rim protectors they let me slip BOTH tires on in a little under 20 minutes! Probably the fastest I’ve ever done it. Pumped the tires up to seat the beads, bounced them hard (I like to toss them in the air and let them land a few times), then pulled the valve stems and refilled with tire goop – the kind that balances the tires and helps seal small leaks. I’ve used it about 6 or 7 years with good results. I know not everyone likes the stuff, but it works for me.

Now, I’m just waiting on my hardware to get back from the cad platers. If it doesn’t make it here by the weekend, I’ll move on to rebuilding the generator and carb. No end of interesting work to do on a total tear down refurb!
Reply With Quote
  #86  
Old 13th January 2015
brucstoudt's Avatar
brucstoudt brucstoudt is offline
Senior Master Custom Bike Builder
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Pottstown PA.
Posts: 15,007
Sportster/Buell Model: xlch
Sportster/Buell Year: 1960
Sportster/Buell Model #2: 883 custom
Sportster/Buell Year #2: '03
Reputation: 1025691
brucstoudt has a reputation beyond reputebrucstoudt has a reputation beyond reputebrucstoudt has a reputation beyond reputebrucstoudt has a reputation beyond reputebrucstoudt has a reputation beyond reputebrucstoudt has a reputation beyond reputebrucstoudt has a reputation beyond reputebrucstoudt has a reputation beyond reputebrucstoudt has a reputation beyond reputebrucstoudt has a reputation beyond reputebrucstoudt has a reputation beyond repute
Default

interesting way to check cam float,Chuck.for the bushing set screw's.do you use 2?1,on top of the other to keep them from backing out?
__________________
72 1000cc barrels and heads, s&s 41/2'' flywheels, sifton cams, s&s super B w/ zippers thunderjet w/yost powertube, andrews gears,and shafts, competition engineering kevlar wet or dry clutch, 72 oil pump, morris magneto w/auto advance and single fire module, cycle electric generator w/electronic regulator,73 cu.in.
Reply With Quote
  #87  
Old 14th January 2015
Chuckthebeatertruck's Avatar
Chuckthebeatertruck Chuckthebeatertruck is offline
Custom Bike Builder
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 2,402
Sportster/Buell Model: Xlh
Sportster/Buell Year: 1959
Sportster/Buell Model #2: Sprint 350
Sportster/Buell Year #2: 1969
Other Motorcycle Model: Guzzi Ambassador
Other Motorcycle Year: 1969
Reputation: 1110836
Chuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond repute
Default

I like to think of it as a lazy way to set the float. Much easier than feeler gauges down the tappet hole. And a bit more accurate, I think.

As for the set screw, dr dicks suggestion was two set screws. I bought both a long one and two short ones. In the end, I decided on one set screw, loctited into place. I then peened the hole in the bush. So, the screw would need to break the loctite, unthread itself, and push through the opening in order to come out. I think that makes it a bit more secure then just a dowel pin peened in the hole.
Reply With Quote
  #88  
Old 14th January 2015
Chuckthebeatertruck's Avatar
Chuckthebeatertruck Chuckthebeatertruck is offline
Custom Bike Builder
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 2,402
Sportster/Buell Model: Xlh
Sportster/Buell Year: 1959
Sportster/Buell Model #2: Sprint 350
Sportster/Buell Year #2: 1969
Other Motorcycle Model: Guzzi Ambassador
Other Motorcycle Year: 1969
Reputation: 1110836
Chuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond repute
Default Cad plating!

I came home yesterday to 2 nice surprises.

First, all my hardware came back from the cad platers. I used Aero Propeller in Broomfield, Co. They did a GREAT job. Parts look new AND they baked everything to aero specs to avoid embrittlement. Yippee.

I did go nuts and had just about everything plated -- including many bits that are usually parkerized. Because I'm doing a refurb to create an accurate rider, and not a full on AMCA restoration, I decided the extra protection of cad was worth it. Simply, I ride more than I clean my bikes. If they get a scrubbing once a year, it's probably a miracle.





Turn around was three weeks -- not bad given the holidays.

I also had my linkert DC rebuild kit in the post. So, I can get that taken care of too!. Kit is much nicer than anticipated, and seems completely worth the $70.

Reply With Quote
  #89  
Old 20th January 2015
Chuckthebeatertruck's Avatar
Chuckthebeatertruck Chuckthebeatertruck is offline
Custom Bike Builder
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 2,402
Sportster/Buell Model: Xlh
Sportster/Buell Year: 1959
Sportster/Buell Model #2: Sprint 350
Sportster/Buell Year #2: 1969
Other Motorcycle Model: Guzzi Ambassador
Other Motorcycle Year: 1969
Reputation: 1110836
Chuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond reputeChuckthebeatertruck has a reputation beyond repute
Default Reassembly!

We turned a big corner this weekend and started putting stuff back together instead of tearing apart.

I started by laying out all of my hardware that came back from the platers. Selected the necessary hardware, and moved to the other side of the bench. Lined up all my bearings, seals, and sealants, to make life easy. I also laid out all my tools so I wouldn't have to hunt for anything while juggling the cases.



The first order of business was to reassemble the bottom end. To make life easy, I decided to heat the left side timkens in an oil bath on a hot plate. It took about ten minutes to bring them up to 250-275 degrees. I used the time to clean the engine cases again, and blow out all the oil passages.



I then used the handy foam blocks T and O shipped my crank in to hold the sprocket shaft up right. I then fished the timken out of the oil and it fell neatly over the shaft and seated on the shoulder. No pressure necessary. Lubed up the bearing and spun it slowly to distribute lube between all the rollers. Next, I slipped the case over the crank, grabbed the spacer ring and the other timken, and carefully put it all together. Hold in position for 30 seconds and everything cools into place. Lube the heck out of the bearing and wait while the lube works into the bearing.





Then the outer ring and retainer went in, followed by the oil seal. Meanwhile, the sprocket shaft extension was heating away in the oil. Pull her out and she made it 3/4 of the way on with gravity. Grabbed a thick washer and the compensator nut, and smoothly drew the shaft into place. Yippee, an assembled left side!

Flip the case over and started prepping it. Assembled the pinion cage and rollers, and applied indian head to both case halves. As it set up, I slipped the pinion cage on the shaft, greased it well, and got ready. Grabbed the right case, and it slipped right into place. Case hardware and the rear motor mount went in to just snug with a palm ratchet and got tightened up in small increments to get a nice even seal. I cleaned off any sealer that oozed out, and had a soda.



Checked my run out, and it was golden. Yippee!

Reassembled the oil pump with a rebuild kit. Took about three tries to get the darn lower gear and key together! In went the pump. Revolve the fly wheel to the timing mark and rotated the pump hole to its notch. Slipped on the breather gear and revolved it a few times to make sure we were spot on. Grabbed the pinion gear out of the oil bath. It went on 3/4 on its own. A few very light taps with a 6 oz stubby ball peen hammer set it at 5/16 from the case surface. Rechecked the run out, still spot on. Installed the cams and shims next. It took a minute and three tries to get all the marks properly lined up. The number 3 cam (front intake) was the bugger. I had to adjust it three times until everything lined up. I revolved the motor several times to triple check the timing. All looked good.



I then greased up the cam cover gasket. I know most guys will use gasket sealant to prevent leaks; but I’m a firm believer in Murphy’s Law. As a result, I prefer to not seal up gaskets for things I may need to take off in the near future – just in case I do need to double check the cam timing. Anyways, I lubed up all the cams and grabbed the cover. It slipped right on! This is the exact opposite of my previous fit, which required a rubber mallet. Being out of round on the crank makes a HUGE difference afterall

Next, I test fit the trans. Mainshaft endplay is good, but the countershaft was too tight at .001!!! I tried a couple of different shims, but no dice. I got it to .006, but that’s too tight for my taste. So, I ordered a couple of new shims to open it up a bit. That’s what I get for not ordering several to begin with.

With that done, I decided to bench prime the oil pump. No sense putting a motor in the frame with a non-working pump! Squirted some lube into the feed line and poured some oil into the cam chest. I then started revolving the motor. Boy, you can feel the precision of the Andrews cam gears. Without the cams, the flywheels just spun like mad. With the gears, there is just a slight drag. It feels “mechanical” and soooo much smoother than the stock cams and the worn out shims. To make a long story short, after about 50 or 60 revolutions air gurgled out of the return with a touch of oil and a few drops started coming out of the big end. A bit more oil and a few more revolutions and we had something like oil pressure. I let it sit for about 10 minutes and got a nice slow drip out of the oil pressure sender hole. Pump primed and a new sending unit in place.

With all that done, it was time to put the motor back in the frame. I popped the trans back out to save wear and tear on my back. Pulled the frame out and put five layers of tape on the lower frame rails. Lifted the motor off the bench and put it next to the frame. Laid out all the fasteners and my tools to make things easy. Then, it was time to finally put things back into the frame for the first time since August. The motor slid right into place. I loosely put in the rear mount bolts and moved to the front. With very little fuss, they slid in and the motor found its centerline. I snugged everything, but didn’t fully tighten them.



Stepped back and took a break. I then prepped the motorcycle lift. Wrapped foam around the lifting legs and positioned it so I could leave the bike on the lift without limiting access to other parts of the garage. Lowered the lift and picked the motor/frame up a whole 2.5 inches. Ah, working smarter.

Strapped her down and hoisted her up in the air. Tossed a cover over the whole lot and called it a day.

Went out the next morning and started assembling the top end. Cylinders and pistons went on with minimal fuss. It was a bit of a struggle to hold the cylinder in one hand and slip the wrist pins into place. I suppose I could have done it by just assembling the pistons to the rods and then compressing each ring into place with my fingers. This is my normal way, but it was cold in the shop and I didn’t want to take my gloves off.

Anyways, I bolted the cylinders down loosely and moved to finishing the heads. Lubed the valve tips, put on fresh gaskets and screwed the rocker boxes down. I had to make up one special bolt for the rear rocker box. Because I’m using a K-frame, the rear head is an even tighter fit to the upper frame rail. Previously, one bolt head was jammed hard against the frame and the whole motor was twisted slightly to the right as a result. As you can imaging, vibration was a bit higher than normal because of this. To compensate, I turned a 5/16 screw to fit flushly in the rocker box in place of the original bolt. As a result, I now have a nice, but still tiny, gap between the modified screw and the frame.

Back to the good stuff. New head gaskets went on, followed by the heads. I grabbed intake manifold and juggled everything to get the best fit possible. Torqued down the cylinder base nuts and hand snugged the head bolts. Re-checked the fit, and we were good to go. Time to start the fun dance of torqueing the head bolts. I like to go a bit at a time. So, we slowly went up in increments of 20; 20, 40, and 60 foot pounds, with a short “rest” between each step for the parts to love one another.



I then stopped and went onto some other minor details like assembling the swing arm. I also popped the tappet guides into place – and suddenly realized I screwed up because the tappets were still on the bench. Pulled them all out, and redid it; only to discover some buggered threads in the front exhaust tappet. Out it came again. Look in the hole, and there’s part of snapped off bolt! Don’t know why I didn’t notice it before – but it totally explains why the other three had original hardware and this one didn’t. Whipped out the left hand drill bits and carefully drilled it out. It didn’t want to budge until only a thin shell remained. Then I got it out, retapped the hole and finally fit the tappet.



Two hours later, I came back and brought the heads up to their final torque of 65 foot pounds. Done and done. I’m sooooo used to all aluminum motors that I forgot just how much torque 65 foot pounds is! None of my other bikes require more than 25-30 pounds for the heads . . . and those extra 40 pounds are a lot!

With all that done, I went back and tightened up the motor mounts, then assembled the top mount and intake manifold.

In looking at the bike, I figured it would be easiest to assemble the oil tank and lines before I mounted up the rear fender. I also wanted to try assembling the rear fender a slightly different way (more on that in a minute) to reduce the risk of scratches to essentially zero.

So, I started by mounting the oil tank bracket. To reduce the risk of cracks, I made up some simple rubber “buffers” from an old inner tube. Five minutes later and we had a firm, but buffered oil tank bracket. I assembled the hard oil lines and grabbed the tank. Five minutes later, it was mounted and plumbed up. MUCH easier with the fender out of the way!





OK, on to the fender. I spent a lot of time looking at the forum and seeing how others mounted their fenders. All the methods seemed to involve mounting the struts to the frame first; then either moving the struts up or spreading them wide an juggling in the fender.

It occurred to me that because I had my shock studs out of the frame – I could bolt the struts and saddle bag plates to the fender loosely, and then put the whole assembly into place. The plates were the kicker. The original bubble bags I’m going to run use these thick, heavy plates. Trying to juggle them and a fender is just a recipe for scratches. Anyways, but pre-assembling, I figured my chances of scratching the fender were reduced to almost zero. So, I gave it a shot. Took two minutes to get everything loosely bolted up and ready. I grabbed my shock studs, put them in the breast pocket of my coveralls and had at it. The fender slipped right in – and it took seconds to slip the studs into place. No muss, no fuss, and no scratches. I slightly rotated the fender up and slipped in the foam buffer pad and support. All the hardware went on next and I snugged everything up. Total time, 10 minutes. Total effort – not much.



I popped the shocks on and called it a night. Sure is nice to see her coming back together.

Reply With Quote
  #90  
Old 20th January 2015
doodah man's Avatar
doodah man doodah man is offline
Senior Master Custom Bike Builder
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: 37° 25' 28" N by -80° 03' 42" W
Posts: 11,175
Sportster/Buell Model: XLCH
Sportster/Buell Year: 1975
Reputation: 894120
doodah man has a reputation beyond reputedoodah man has a reputation beyond reputedoodah man has a reputation beyond reputedoodah man has a reputation beyond reputedoodah man has a reputation beyond reputedoodah man has a reputation beyond reputedoodah man has a reputation beyond reputedoodah man has a reputation beyond reputedoodah man has a reputation beyond reputedoodah man has a reputation beyond reputedoodah man has a reputation beyond repute
Default

i love watching someone's build come together! your enthusiasm is contagious!
__________________
"when you don't know where you're going, any road'll take you there"
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 01:21.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
XL Forum® - Linson Media LLC