Today I join the rank and file "taxes paid" crowd of sportster owners. The only problem is - I may have made a mistake. I had the steeler do my work, SE air, re-jet, Vance & Heins slip-ons, but when I fired-up the bike - I almost had a heart attack. Those V&H slip-ons are so damn loud, I will be pissing off all the neighbors. On my way home I passed a traffic law enforcment official, as I passed him I noticed his head turned ALL the way around to see what was goin by. Oh well I guess I'll be on a first name basis with my local traffic court judge. I will be posting pics, and I will try some audio for those interested.

hey 2wheel...what part of rochester are you from (so i can avoid the cops)...i am expecting my new cycle shack full system any day now. :banana

On my way home I passed a traffic law enforcment official, as I passed him I noticed his head turned ALL the way around to see what was goin by.
he was just thinking...."man I wish I had a Harley!" :banadevi

hey 2wheel...what part of rochester are you from (so i can avoid the cops)...i am expecting my new cycle shack full system any day now. :banana

STEER CLEAR OF FAIRPORT!

hey 2wheel...what part of rochester are you from (so i can avoid the cops)...i am expecting my new cycle shack full system any day now. :banana

Avoid him hell!! You got fuzz bait now; take advantage of it, and ride free!!! ;)

Man if you think the V&H are loud you should hear the D&Ds I just got they use a hollow core baffle system and are even louder but not as loud as my 66 with 2 inch drags with no baffles
I like loud pipes but you have to use your head and not rev them up in some places I have never really had a problem with loud pipes
I used to work in a very small town and the local cop used to stop me just to shoot the breeze the first thing he would always say was I really like the sound of them pipes and after a month or so I saw him at a Bike show on a new Road King with some of the loudest pipes I have ever heard so it just goes to show you even the FUZZ likes loud pipes you just have to watch out for the guys that are trying to make a name for themselves

I was checking out the Vanes & Hines website because I like the look of those pipes, I noticed they sell a quiet baffle as an option. That may help if you are interested in making your bike a little quieter.

I noticed they sell a quiet baffle as an option.


I've heard that QUIET baffle at work.....It ain't.

I was checking out the Vanes & Hines website because I like the look of those pipes, I noticed they sell a quiet baffle as an option. That may help if you are interested in making your bike a little quieter.

The steeler told me the quiet baffle only reduces the loudness by 3 db. (I'll keep the $60)

3 Decibals? I hardly think that will make a difference. Id keep my $$$ also. That shit dont grow on trees you know!!

STEER CLEAR OF FAIRPORT!
I work in Fairport.. (CrossKeys Office Park near intersection of routes 250/31), and I have the SEII pipes (loud).. so far no problems with the cops.. when I see them I keep the accelerations to a minimum and try to keep a low profile.
Where in Fairport are you riding?.. in the village?

The best part of these pipes was the smile on my face when I cranked it up and the shear dissapointment on my OL's face when I pulled in the garage.

I work in Fairport.. (CrossKeys Office Park near intersection of routes 250/31), and I have the SEII pipes (loud).. so far no problems with the cops.. when I see them I keep the accelerations to a minimum and try to keep a low profile.
Where in Fairport are you riding?.. in the village?

I work in Ceadrwood office park neighbor. I could throw a rock & hit Cross Keys! Small world bud!

3 Decibals? I hardly think that will make a difference. Id keep my $$$ also. That shit dont grow on trees you know!!

Not to be argumentative, but 3 decibels of reduction is actually fairly significant, depending, of course, on the frequencies attenuated...

If 3 dB is the AVERAGE, it may well be significantly more AND less across the band...

To put it into perspective, for those who don't know (and none of you SHOULD, except Gary and Dwardy, and perhaps a few others...this stuff gives me a headache, )...

3 dB of reduction is shown thusly:

1st dB= half as loud
2nd dB= half again
3rd dB=half again

Inversely, the same holds true....a 1 dB increase is twice as loud...etc., etc.

Not to be argumentative, but 3 decibels of reduction is actually fairly significant, depending, of course, on the frequencies attenuated...

If 3 dB is the AVERAGE, it may well be significantly more AND less across the band...

To put it into perspective, for those who don't know (and none of you SHOULD, except Gary and Dwardy, and perhaps a few others...this stuff gives me a headache, )...

3 dB of reduction is shown thusly:

1st dB= half as loud
2nd dB= half again
3rd dB=half again

Inversely, the same holds true....a 1 dB increase is twice as loud...etc., etc.

I would agree with everything you said, however when you compare 100 db, and 103 db I do not think you would notice the variation like you would when comparing say 1 db to 4 db.

I would agree with everything you said, however when you compare 100 db, and 103 db I do not think you would notice the variation like you would when comparing say 1 db to 4 db.

Its all relative...

If a thing moves air pressure sufficient to be measured in dB, the difference between 100 dB and 101 dB is still a factor of 2....twice as loud...

I've mixed concerts most of my life...in that environment, I can certainly tell you the difference...

the "annoying part" of exhaust noise is transient, yet its the mids and highs, directionally, that will cause a marked increase....

Again, its all relative....

Chuck, I accept your view....This is why I voted for you for moderator.

Chuck, I accept your view....This is why I voted for you for moderator.

I'm too freakin obnoxious, but thanx for the compliment...

Unlike in real life, we voted right! :p

I would agree with everything you said, however when you compare 100 db, and 103 db I do not think you would notice the variation like you would when comparing say 1 db to 4 db.
very interesting point...it just so happens that I measured both my bike and my wife's bike with a dB meter as prescribed by law in my state...my bike was 105dB and my wife's bike was 102dB...you could really hear a difference for sure...somewhere around there is a table with typical dB ratings...it lists things that you might hear and how loud they are on average...it really makes it easy to see how just a small increase on a logarithmic scale changes everything...the Richter Scale is the same way...only an 8.0 is ten times bigger than a 7.0 and a 7.1 is twice as big as a 7.0...but once again I drift off into geekdom...

I work in Ceadrwood office park neighbor. I could throw a rock & hit Cross Keys! Small world bud!
You're next door.. I walk through your parking lot now and then at lunch time on my way to Mark's Pizzeria, or Bill Gray's... I haven't seen a Sporty there though.. anyway..I'll be 'listening' for you then on my rides to and from work. :smoke

Not to be argumentative, but 3 decibels of reduction is actually fairly significant, depending, of course, on the frequencies attenuated...

If 3 dB is the AVERAGE, it may well be significantly more AND less across the band...

To put it into perspective, for those who don't know (and none of you SHOULD, except Gary and Dwardy, and perhaps a few others...this stuff gives me a headache, )...

3 dB of reduction is shown thusly:

1st dB= half as loud
2nd dB= half again
3rd dB=half again

Inversely, the same holds true....a 1 dB increase is twice as loud...etc., etc.


Actually 3dB louder = twice as loud and 3dB lower = half as loud, this is why:

dB is a logarithmic scale and the formula to turn the linear noise intensity to dB is something like this:

10*log base 10 (linear noise intensity) = noise intensity in dB

lets say the linear noise intesity is 50 (which is what our ear hears, we have a linear scale in our ear):

10*log base 10 (50) = 16.99 dB

lets find now say that we hear something twice as loud which is a linear noise intensity of 100:

10*log base 10 (100) = 20 dB

Now if you subtract the 2 results 20-16.99=3.01 you can see that every 3 dB the intensity doubles or halves, depends on if you are increasing or decreasing intensity.

Actually 3dB louder = twice as loud and 3dB lower = half as loud, this is why:

dB is a logarithmic scale and the formula to turn the linear noise intensity to dB is something like this:

10*log base 10 (linear noise intensity) = noise intensity in dB

lets say the linear noise intesity is 50 (which is what our ear hears, we have a linear scale in our ear):

10*log base 10 (50) = 16.99 dB

lets find now say that we hear something twice as loud which is a linear noise intensity of 100:

10*log base 10 (100) = 20 dB

Now if you subtract the 2 results 20-16.99=3.01 you can see that every 3 dB the intensity doubles or halves, depends on if you are increasing or decreasing intensity.

Awesome....see? My head hurts already....

Is this formula based on any specific frequency?

Why is this different from my audio training? I don't understand :o

Is this dBU or dBV?

Awesome....see? My head hurts already....

Is this formula based on any specific frequency?

Why is this different from my audio training? I don't understand :o

Is this dBU or dBV?

This formula is not frequency dependant. This is the formula used for any radio, whether it's voltage, power, noise intensity. You can look here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decibel#Acoustics) for more information, or if you wanna just bore yourself to sleep. Here is an excerpt:

−3 dB ≈ ½ power

A level difference of ±3 dB is roughly double/half power (equal to a ratio of 1.995). That is why it is commonly used as a marking on sound equipment and the like.

Another common sequence is 1, 2, 5, 10, 20, 50 ... . These numbers are very close to being equally spaced in terms of their logarithms. The actual values would be 1, 2.15, 4.64, 10 ... .

The conversion for decibels is often simplified to: "+3 dB means two times the power and 1.414 times the voltage", and "+6 dB means four times the power and two times the voltage ".

While this is accurate for many situations, it is not exact. As stated above, decibels are defined so that +10 dB means "ten times the power". From this, we calculate that +3 dB actually multiplies the power by 103/10. This is a power ratio of 1.9953 or about 0.25% different from the "times 2" power ratio that is sometimes assumed. A level difference of +6 dB is 3.9811, about 0.5% different from 4.

To contrive a more serious example, consider converting a large decibel figure into its linear ratio, for example 120 dB. The power ratio is correctly calculated as a ratio of 1012 or one trillion. But if we use the assumption that 3 dB means "times 2", we would calculate a power ratio of 2120/3 = 240 = 1.0995 × 1012, giving a 10% error.

This formula is not frequency dependant. This is the formula used for any radio, whether it's voltage, power, noise intensity. You can look here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decibel#Acoustics) for more information, or if you wanna just bore yourself to sleep. Here is an excerpt:

−3 dB ≈ ½ power

A level difference of ±3 dB is roughly double/half power (equal to a ratio of 1.995). That is why it is commonly used as a marking on sound equipment and the like.

Another common sequence is 1, 2, 5, 10, 20, 50 ... . These numbers are very close to being equally spaced in terms of their logarithms. The actual values would be 1, 2.15, 4.64, 10 ... .

The conversion for decibels is often simplified to: "+3 dB means two times the power and 1.414 times the voltage", and "+6 dB means four times the power and two times the voltage ".

While this is accurate for many situations, it is not exact. As stated above, decibels are defined so that +10 dB means "ten times the power". From this, we calculate that +3 dB actually multiplies the power by 103/10. This is a power ratio of 1.9953 or about 0.25% different from the "times 2" power ratio that is sometimes assumed. A level difference of +6 dB is 3.9811, about 0.5% different from 4.

To contrive a more serious example, consider converting a large decibel figure into its linear ratio, for example 120 dB. The power ratio is correctly calculated as a ratio of 1012 or one trillion. But if we use the assumption that 3 dB means "times 2", we would calculate a power ratio of 2120/3 = 240 = 1.0995 × 1012, giving a 10% error.

F it, my head hurts..

I think weighting curves may be at the source of my pain.... :(

I feel responsible I RETRACT this post!

Nawwwww....

Regardless of the curve, or my mistake in calculation, or whatever, it IS noticeable at 3dB.....enough to keep a cop from stopping you? Silly question...WTF KNOWS?!?!?! :)

F it, my head hurts..

I think weighting curves may be at the source of my pain.... :(

You're probably right, the human ear has a certain frequency response and the weighting function of our ears may indeed be throwing a wrench in this.

Nawwwww....

Regardless of the curve, or my mistake in calculation, or whatever, it IS noticeable at 3dB.....enough to keep a cop from stopping you? Silly question...WTF KNOWS?!?!?! :)

Chances are that any reasonable cop won't stop you, so long as you act reasonable rather than annoying. Which means dont blip the f'n throttle and drive with safety being your #1 priority.

very interesting point...it just so happens that I measured both my bike and my wife's bike with a dB meter as prescribed by law in my state...my bike was 105dB and my wife's bike was 102dB...you could really hear a difference for sure...somewhere around there is a table with typical dB ratings...it lists things that you might hear and how loud they are on average...it really makes it easy to see how just a small increase on a logarithmic scale changes everything...the Richter Scale is the same way...only an 8.0 is ten times bigger than a 7.0 and a 7.1 is twice as big as a 7.0...but once again I drift off into geekdom...
You guys ARE dorks :roflblack . IMHO your all right. the dB scale is a log scale so 3dB is a large difference, however, the ability to detect a difference between two stimuli is proportional to the stimulus intensity (I think that's Weber's Law, someone check me on that). Thus, the more intense the stimuli, the more different they have to be to preceive a difference. That being said I like John's method, I'm a strong believer in empiricism and in loud pipes:danceele :danceele .

I run straight drags, I use the pipes as a horn.As far as I`m concerned when I`m ridding I can`t hear the pipes so its not so loud!!

3dB.....enough to keep a cop from stopping you?
that depends on how fast you are going while you are 3dB quieter :roflblack

that depends on how fast you are going while you are 3dB quieter :roflblack
Good point, I think you'll have to apply the Doppler principle for the answer ;) . I have related question though. If a copper tries to pull you over for having loud pipes but you can't hear the siren because your pipes are too loud do you still have to pull over? :dunno

Good point, I think you'll have to apply the Doppler principle for the answer ;) . I have related question though. If a copper tries to pull you over for having loud pipes but you can't hear the siren because your pipes are too loud do you still have to pull over? :dunno


:roflblack :roflblack :roflblack :D

If a tree falls down and crashes in the forest and no one is around to hear, does it make any noise? :wonderlan

My brother still lives in Rochester. I lived there a few years before joining the Corps. He lives in Greece. I remember a lot of bikes hanging around the beach at the penny arcade in Charlotte. From what he says the cops are mostly after the sport bikes doing wheelies and stoppies and stuff like that.

I have the V&H straight Shots, and they are loud, but if I am in a residential area, I go easy onthe throttle and they are not to bad. And I live in SoCal.....a lot of beach cities around here are notorious for Fing with us.