Hi everyone

Santa brought me an NRHS 88" big bore kit.
After talking to Gyahmers, it seems that I need some opinions from the experts.

Here is where I am at right now.

04 XL 883 converted to 1200

stock 883 heads
S.E. air cleaner
S.E. cam with .551" lift
S.E. street legal ignition
1200 pistons
Wet Dreamz pipes

I'm going to replace the ham can with a Hypercharger Pro.
The guy at the shop says I should do head work now while they are off.

Do I have to do head work, or can I leave them alone?
Should I do the Stage 2 or Stage 3 mods to my 883 heads?
Should I, or will I have to replace the heads?

All opinions and help is welcome.

Thanks
jh

I would go with new XB Heads!! You will be getting more bang for your Buck if you do!! Plus you'll be able to do more with them at a later Date, If you so desire!!! :D

I would not put HC on a big motor. When I got my 1250 kit, I didn't like it performance (butterflies wouldn't open all the way) and took it off, I have a Forcewinder on there now and it is great. The Pro is relegated to a box on my shelf, probabaly destined for eBay at some point.

As far as heads go, do you have to? No. Should you? Well hell yes, you got the big bore kit, might as well go all the way and get the XB heads. The power is in the heads and you don't want them to be you limiting factoron your new torque monster motor. My Stage 3 XB heads flow over 65cfm each (!). It is all about money and what you can afford.

--Sean

Heads are where the power is . If you use your stock heads the whole job is really a poor use of your money. You are probably going to be way off on the H.P if you don't do the heads. Spend the money. It will make any further power increases unnec.

I am interested in hearing more about this forcewinder. Alot of claims of better power and no dyno runs. I would like to see why I should pay 400 bucks for an air cleaner. Atleast my Hypercharger is cool looking. May not work but looks cool. I would love a closeup of a forcewinder so I could try and make something like it to try.

Thanks for the great input everyone! This was an unexpected gift so I wasn't prepared to spend more money but "if you want to play you gotta pay!"


I don't want to half ass the job, I plan on keeping this bike for a long time.

rottenralph, I heard from a shop that they are adequate but can tend to pressurize the full bowl with the force of wind coming in and dump excess fuel. There is a fix for it but by have to bother.

What do you think Barry, is the hole in the bottom og the Hypercharger there to keep from overpressurizing our carbs. I have no idea but I still don't like the loof of the forcewinder. Rather use a velocity stack and a piece of pantyhose to filter.

Don't know for sure, I just heard them saying that the vent hole next to the carb mounting bolts was getting pressureized under some conditions. It had to be vented outside the intake system or something like that.

Do I have to do head work, or can I leave them alone?
Should I do the Stage 2 or Stage 3 mods to my 883 heads?
Should I, or will I have to replace the heads?I am under the impression that the XB heads on your 883 have the same valves as the XB Heads for a 1200. The differance is that the dish/chamber is smaller in the 883 heads to match the pistions being used in that engine.

IMHO, matching the heads to the pistons would be important enough to justify going all out and doing a Stage 3, especially on such a radical conversion.

Someone, please correct me if I'm wrong on this.

The 883 heads have way smaller valves than the 1200. Do the XB heads come in 883 size?

I believe that XB's are 1200 size heads and the 883's are standard heads..
The XB's have a "bathtub" Chamber and the 883's are round, which make the XB's the "Wanted" Heads!!!! :D

The 883 heads have way smaller valves than the 1200. Do the XB heads come in 883 size?This is one reason I am asking if I'm wrong. I went down to Capistrano Harley today and I was told that that valves are the same in both heads on the 04 Sportster models but the dish was smaller in the 883.

Now, Joe (I'm fronting you off dude.) has been wrong in the past when I ask him these type of questions, go figure right? So this is why I asked to be corrected if I'm wrong. I told him I would ask this question here at the forum too and you know what he said to me, "Tell them Gina (parts guru for them) gave me the info."

I believe that XB's are 1200 size heads and the 883's are standard heads..
The XB's have a "bathtub" Chamber and the 883's are round, which make the XB's the "Wanted" Heads!!!! :D
Thx bro, now there's the answer I was looking for! ;) I knew the 1200's have the bathtub chamber but wasn't sure about the 883's head.

I actually have a set of both in my possesion right now. The 883 intake valve is about the size of the 1200 exhaust valve. Looking at the two chambers side by side is night and day. I wasn't sure in the Buell XB9R had special heads or just use the 1200 heads.

1200 heads have a 1.8ish intake and 1.6ish exhaust
883 heads have a 1.6ish intake and 1.4ish exhaust.

1200 heads have a 1.8ish intake and 1.6ish exhaust
883 heads have a 1.6ish intake and 1.4ish exhaust.
That's interesting, I was with Joe when looking up the info and the service manual was saying they were the same size. Humm... I'll have to check that out again. Maybe we were looking at the wrong thing/place/something.

G'day

To my knowledge the 883 heads are basicly the same internally as they were pre 04...

The 04 1200's a re a better head.



In reply to the origional question......

I'm going 88" on mine as soon as I can get a clear run and tell all the customers to %^%&%&^% off and leave me in peace...

I've talked with both Aaron and justin over this issue before I bought 'em and I've been researchin this area for over 5 years now...goin back to when Wiseco brought out the first 84 kit...

It is NOT a cheap exersize..

The motor must be removed from the frame and completely stripped to bare cases..

The cases then need to be put back together and bored to suit the larger barrells.

Seeing as you are in the states I would send them to Nallins to do and get them to modify your heads at the same time...

By the sound of it you are not after every last HP in there so the expense on goind to the 1200 heads as a starting point is just $$$ wasted.

Give Aaron or Justin a call first and tell them EXACTLY what you want out of the bike and how much $$$$$ you have to spend.

Thanks for jumping in Stevo, I'm learning a lot in this thread. I have a question for you.

I've been told that the stock cases don't have enough material between the cylinders for boring and in doing so the thinner walls could result in fatigue/stress and failure. I've been recommended to go with an after market long block instead. What is your (or anyones elses) thoughts on this?

G'day

I'd use an S&S long block too....IF I had the $$$$$$$.... It's certainly the better way to go...

Machining for the new barrells will make the block walls very thin around that area and I'm gonna fit the centre bolt and then machine it out a bit, to help as much as possible..

At the end of the day this conversion has been done many times and I would hazard a a guess that part of the reason for problems is that most people that do this conv are looking for WAY more power. This is gonna stress everything and things may have broken anyay....


I just missed out on a wrecked 883 the other day.... woulda loved to have used that block instead of mine but that's life.....



As I said before .....I'll get this thing done soooooon...HOPEFULLY....just those bloody customers keep annoyin me..

The S&S or STD cases are the way to go but at over 2 grand (OUCH) AND they STILL need boring -- it is hard to justify the cost.

Now Justin from Nallins tells me:

Hello Ray,

Thanks for the inquiry, now lets see if we can address your concerns.

First on case integrity. We installed literally hundreds of these kits over the years and in all those installations, many of which were on drag bikes and under extreme stress, we've never had a set of cases crack. One reason for this is the way these Nik-A-Sil cylinders are constructed, which a thinner spigot wall where they slide down into the cases compared to a stock-style two-piece cylinder. By having this thinner spigot we don't have to be nearly as invasive when the cases are cut, so there's still way more than enough material there to maintain structural integrity.That makes me feel better about boring the cases.

I'm kind of torn on using my cases or not so I've looked into buying new cases from Harley, I believe they are around $800.00. Purchase them at Chicago HD and that price is reduced 20% and have Chicago ship it straight to Nallin's for boring, total cost around a grand. The 88" kit from Nallin's is $1300.00 plus shipping so for the price of the S&S or STD cases when everything is finally delivered to the door I've spent less money than the S&S or STD cases alone and I can go straight to the wrench. :D

Or, tear down everthing myself and have my buddy bore the cases and I'm right at $1500.00. Not bad considering what your getting.

man I'd luuuuv ta be in the states


tripple all your prices and ya got 'em in OZ $$$$ makes it real hard....


As I said I've done a bit of research and am still gonna do it to mine ...
so nuff said...I don't jump into things.....

slow and steady in the workshop...fast and reliable on the race track or the street.

stevo ...

Obviously, your paying triple prices because all these parts are coming from the US of A.

I can't understand why nobody in OZ Land don't manufacture parts like this.

What's the deal ..... Nobody but yourself rides Harleys down there?

man I'd luuuuv ta be in the states


tripple all your prices and ya got 'em in OZ $$$$ makes it real hard....

As I said I've done a bit of research and am still gonna do it to mine ...
so nuff said...I don't jump into things.....

slow and steady in the workshop...fast and reliable on the race track or the street.
I don't jump into things either my friend and I'm in no hurry. And like you I'm still doing my research and sizing up everything too. That's why I'm trying to get all the information I can before I commit to this. And I've got a lot on my plate right now as it is and this conversion looks like it's a few months down the road.

I like your style Stevo, slow and steady -- fast and reliable, that's the ticket for sure!

G'day Turbo


Yeah but it comes down to population density and yours is denser than ours... ;)

I'm dusting off this old thread for an update. I've almost completed the motor conversion.
I deceided to go with the Stage 3 heads, a CV44 carb, and the 3" HurricaneFlow AC.
As of last week I've finished the 500 mile break in.

WOW, what a difference!

I was merging on to the highway, a truck was in the right lane so I nailed it. It was a 3rd gear roll on.
While I was shifting to 4th, I was watching the speedo. It was going up like a tach needle usually does. I shifted to 5th and it just took off! When I started to let off, the speedo needle was over the 120 mark by about a half inch.
I still had about a half of 5th gear I was too scared to use! The pull is so smooth.
I lost alot of low end torque when I put the WetDreamz on. Straight pipes will do that. So because of that and the fact they pop like a cannon when I decelerate, I need a new exhaust. The WetDreamz were for looks, and I bought them before I knew I was going to do the motor.

When I change the exhaust, probably this winter, I'm going to replace my SE cams with a set of Red Shifts. Then I should be done.
I've moved to South Carolina, and it seems that the closest dyno to me is now in Atlanta. I'm real anxious to get some numbers, but this may take awhile.

I highly reccommend the 88" kit from NRHS. Justin was very helpful with his suggestions. The parts are all top quality.

Not only do I have the fastest Sporty around, but I now scare the hell out of the kids on the crotch rockets as they try to blow me off. :D

Jimmy, what is your brake hooked to. NICE BIKE, like the rear sprocket too. Can't wait to see you h.p numbers. I am about to start a hundred h.p. quest. I want to do it with my 1200 cc's

Jimmy, what is your brake hooked to

Ralph

If you mean the rear brake. It's connected to the arm for the master cylinder. It's usually hidden by the stock pipes.

I lost alot of low end torque when I put the WetDreamz on. Straight pipes will do that. So because of that and the fact they pop like a cannon when I decelerate, I need a new exhaust. The WetDreamz were for looks, and I bought them before I knew I was going to do the motor.


Torque cones wont help?

Mabey aftermarket power baffles?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v248/Turbota/DSCN3339Medium.jpg

Damn, that's a nice looking bike!

Very clean ...

Torque cones wont help?

Mabey aftermarket power baffles?

The guys that jet coated the pipes took them out and forgot to put them back in.
I need a good 2 in to 1 pipe. I wish I could afford the Force pipe that NRHS sells.

Thanks Turbota!

Jimmy that is a sweet bike, I WANT 88ci SO BAD!!!! So all in all what was the final total? Did you do the engine work yourself? I've looking at NRHS website and it looks like for the kit I need about $2000. I have a stock 1200c. Thanks

sounds like a screamer.

So all in all what was the final total? Did you do the engine work yourself?

NO COAST CHOPPER

I had my local indy do the work. With machine costs the total labor was $1100

By the by, where in Chicago are you? I just moved from Northbrook.

Cool, it sounds really sick. Maybe Santa can bring me one. BTW I live in Naperville.