Knocking and Oil light is on

[BMFC]

I was riding home from work and the oil light came on. Just as I noticed that the bike started knocking pretty bad. Loud enough for my wife to notice from inside the house. I checked the oil tank and I'm good on oil. I haven't started the bike to listen to it. Any ideas where I should start? Oil pump, lifters, pushrods or something else? its a 97 1200. Thanks.

[Rico 05R]

Connecting rods/crankshaft???

[TurboDog]

By the time You HEAR an engine knock, it's too late to save it, 90% of the time.

If You'd heard a knock, but it wasn't accompanied with the oil light I'd say to check other things, like the primary chain being loose, but knocking+ light equals seriously bad news.

Disect the oil filter with shears or another non-saw method ( So's not to add shavings to the media) and look for metal. If You find much more than trace ammounts, coupled with knock+ light, start saving Your money... I would say Your bearings are likely toast.

[racerwill]

connecting rod/ crankshaft.......

not good

Ww

[BMFC]

How can this happen with 12000 miles and good oil?

[TurboDog]

For example, the bike running hot, the oil pump drive gear/ key being destroyed, neglect, wrong type/weight oil for the conditions, the list goes on.

Last year My little cousin came VERY close to blowing up the engine in His Nightster. He shut it down the microsecond the light came on. The light coming on and valvetrain noise indicated the problem: low oil level and really dirty burnt up oil. But the real root of the problem was he'd been running the bike way outta tune with straight drag pipes, a freeflow air filter setup and the STOCK MAP IN THE PCM, creating massive overheating by leaning it out bigtime!

So as Ya can see, lots of things can influence the problem. Make damn sure You find the ROOT CAUSE of the failure when it's torn down for diagnosis. Nothing is worse than throwing $$$ away rebuilding an engine when the root cause of the failure is overlooked. Kinda like a guy who assembles an engine without cleaning the oil passages, and wonders why his bearings get wiped out immediatly, grenading His fresh motor...
Don't be that guy.

[Crosshairs]

How can this happen with 12000 miles and good oil?

lugging the motor consistently will take out the bearings also...3 out of 4 Harleys that I pass on the road are up in 5th gear at 35 MPH..I can almost hear the bearings being hammered to death........I just laugh as I go by....and I'm still in 2nd gear ...

[AustinXL]

lugging the motor consistently will take out the bearings also...3 out of 4 Harleys that I pass on the road are up in 5th gear at 35 MPH..I can almost hear the bearings being hammered to death........I just laugh as I go by....and I'm still in 2nd gear ...

+1 on this - I couldnt believe how low my RPMs were on my Sporty during normal riding until I got a tach. Some people keep them that low for whatever reason with a tach, I upped my shift points drastically once I spent 10 minutes with a tach on the bike.

[TurboDog]

lugging the motor consistently will take out the bearings also...3 out of 4 Harleys that I pass on the road are up in 5th gear at 35 MPH..I can almost hear the bearings being hammered to death........I just laugh as I go by....and I'm still in 2nd gear ...

100% correct!! Guys that lug the motor constantly kill it faster than a guy who constantly bounces it off the rev limiter. Riding style contributes big time to engine life. On the opposite end of the spectrum is a bike that came into the dealer when I worked there, His softail had no oil pressure, the tech found the oil pump gearotor was grenaded. The Dude confessed He'd been at the Rally, intoxicated, and basically held it against the rev limited for @ a minute when the oil light came on... His dumb as was lucky the.oil pump was.the.only thing that blew...

[AustinXL]

100% correct!! Guys that lug the motor constantly kill it faster than a guy who constantly bounces it off the rev limiter. Riding style contributes big time to engine life. On the opposite end of the spectrum is a bike that came into the dealer when I worked there, His softail had no oil pressure, the tech found the oil pump gearotor was grenaded. The Dude confessed He'd been at the Rally, intoxicated, and basically held it against the rev limited for @ a minute when the oil light came on... His dumb as was lucky the.oil pump was.the.only thing that blew...

:frownthre I don't get the disrespect some people show their bikes - with the amount of money I put into mine (bike + improvements adds up....) the dumbest thing I'm gonna do with it ever is ride too fast....

[Shu]

Before you go completely into freak mode, pull the oil pump apart and check to see if it broke. It will make a horrible noise and cause the light.

[1250IRON]

+1 on this - I couldnt believe how low my RPMs were on my Sporty during normal riding until I got a tach. Some people keep them that low for whatever reason with a tach, I upped my shift points drastically once I spent 10 minutes with a tach on the bike.

^^^^That's the truth! Every harley should come with a tach . I was amazed at how badly i was lugging mine. Not to mention lugging it your also losing most of the fun factor that comes with riding in the right rpm range.:D

[milmat1]

I would offer that the oil pump may have failed, or something in the oiling system died leaving the engine starved for oil. The light just indicates that the oil pressure dropped...

Exactly what kind of noise and Did the light come on before or after the noise started ??

How long was the engine running after the oil light came on ??

It may not be catostrophic just yet !!

[KevinJ]

before you go completely into freak mode, pull the oil pump apart and check to see if it broke. It will make a horrible noise and cause the light.

+1

[AustinXL]

^^^^That's the truth! Every harley should come with a tach . I was amazed at how badly i was lugging mine. Not to mention lugging it your also losing most of the fun factor that comes with riding in the right rpm range.:D

Yeah its a lot more fun when you're around 3500ish, at least in my opinion. Bike really responds well. Glad I put the tach on well before the turbo, now I stay between 3500-5000 constantly.

[stocker883l]

lugging the motor consistently will take out the bearings also...3 out of 4 Harleys that I pass on the road are up in 5th gear at 35 MPH..I can almost hear the bearings being hammered to death........I just laugh as I go by....and I'm still in 2nd gear ...

Yep, I have more friends that kill their bikes within 15,000 miles by not riding them correctly. Puttin' along at low rpms will kill these motors faster than they were ever intended to go. I never lug my bike, unless I unintentionally do it, and then I down shift to the appropriate gear. It's just a big lawnmower engine, it's designed to run best at certain rpms.

[BMFC]

I don't want to say I ride it hard but I'm not pussy footing around town. Lower RPMs is an issue for me.

I'm not sure how long the light was on but the sound may have been more of a loud tick than a knock. It started about 2 blocks from my house. It did seem like a top end valve tick from lack of oil. Maybe I'm just being hopeful, I really can't believe that my bottom end is trashed.

I guess I'll start at the oil pump and go on from there. Any other advise is appreciated. Thanks, I'll keep you posted.

[steelworker]

I'm not sure how long the light was on but the sound may have been more of a loud tick than a knock. It started about 2 blocks from my house. It did seem like a top end valve tick from lack of oil. Maybe I'm just being hopeful, I really can't believe that my bottom end is trashed.

I guess I'll start at the oil pump and go on from there. Any other advise is appreciated. Thanks, I'll keep you posted.

Check the oil pump, but check also the oil pump drive gear on the end of the crankshaft (inside the pinion gear), which can shear teeth. If you caught it quick, and can find all the pieces, you may be lucky.

edit: Could also be the pinion gear has sheared the end of the woodruff key that locates it. Only the very end of the key fits inside the slot in the pinion gear.

edit2: mark the position of the ignition pick-up back plate before removing it (either scribe around the two pillar bolts that hold it, or scribe a line on the plate and a matching line on the inside of the housing), so you can reassemble it in the same position.

[MN Mailman]

Before you go tearing into shit, pull your plugs, put your bike on a lift, in neutral, high gear, and spin the rear wheel slowly.

You may be able to feel/hear something to pinpoint your problem better.

And look at your pistons through the plug hole while you're at it.

[BMFC]

I finally got to the garage and here is what I figured out. I pulled the plugs and turned the wheel, it sounds fine. No noise at at. Then I pulled the oil pump to find nothing wrong. I removed the cam cover too just to be safe and checked the splines in the crank, nothing. Then I pulled the rocker boxes off and checked the pushrods which looked fine. WTF is the problem? If my wife didn't hear it too I'd think I was crazy. What should I look for next? I'm at a loss.