Why on earth does this bike have a 5200 rpm limiter..durability...longetivity..why is it less than the other bikes? They put good heads and compression and cams and a decent single fire ignition..then neuter it with a 5200 rpm limiter..lol

Good question! One that I also never understood about the 1200S's. And then to top it off, Aftermarket ignitions for the S's are hard to find. Stevo, you have an S, what do you suggest?

Maybe becaus it will make engine life longer?? :rolleyes:
I had my XL dynoed a few times ... no hp gain over 4800-5000rpm! So do I want to hit the rev limiter? No, I never hit the rev limiter as its useless to do so .... :D

Foreign engines have lighter flywheels and components. They also install counter balancers. This allows much greater rpms. HD hasn't gotten there yet with the Sportie and BTand it's doubtful if they will anytime soon. It would eliminate the potato potato sound that's HD's hallmark.

Foreign engines have lighter flywheels and components. They also install counter balancers. This allows much greater rpms. HD hasn't gotten there yet with the Sportie and BTand it's doubtful if they will anytime soon. It would eliminate the potato potato sound that's HD's hallmark.

But the Softails have a balanced engine. They do have totally different sound, but still MoCo pure. I think Danielle's point is right on, There was a thread about this on the old site and consensus was pretty much in agreement if I remember right. If there's no more HP to squeeze out past the limiter what's the point? However, I can say that my bike FEELS like it's still pulling hard when it hits the limiter so I'm not sure what to think. I guess the dyno doesn't lie. Here's another thought though; is the "no more HP" argument valid for every gear? Makes sense for fifth, but are we giving up acceleration through the gears by shifting too soon?

I think it has more to do with the pushrod valve train which quickly loses efficiency at high RPM. I've witnessed the same observations as Danielle; you don't gain much power over 5,000 RPM without making radical valve train and cam modifications.

Maybe becaus it will make engine life longer?? :rolleyes:
I had my XL dynoed a few times ... no hp gain over 4800-5000rpm! So do I want to hit the rev limiter? No, I never hit the rev limiter as its useless to do so .... :D

I peak around 5500 RPMs on my HP and torque.

Yes I undserstand it is a pushrod Vtwin...but the regular sportsters have a maximum reccomended redline of 6k and my sport is 5600 acording to my owners manual..I am asking why it is lower...

Wickedsprint,

I knew what you meant:) Here's some insight I had after signing off last night. The 883 is rev limited at 6,000 rpms, the 1200 is at 5200 rpms???? and the Sport is at 5600??? HD allowed the 883 to turn more rpms because it's rotating mass was less than the 1200's (piston weight, etc). They really limited the 1200 low because of that and also geared it differently to 'contol' the vibration at typical highway speeds. Since the 1200 Sport has a different grind cam and better heads (negligable IMO) HD let it turn up to 5600 rpms to take advantage of those performance modifications.

Peak HP on stock models will be at or below the rev limit. The increase in power on the Sport from 5600 to 6000 rpms would be maybe one pony. See www.techbill.net and click on his dyno run #16 which compares the SE 6800 ignition to the stock module.

So for all intesive purposes, you really would be starting to flog a dead horse if you weren't shifting at about 5500 rpms on a stage one sport.

Add a little headwork, maybe a differnet cam set, an SE 6800 ignition, and it'll pull up to and past 6,000 rpms, but with those increased rpms come increased stress on the engine. These are fairly long stroke engines and the valve trains are not anything special. Yeah, they could turn more rpms and make more power(properly massaged), but it comes at a cost of longevity. HD had to make engines that will live. And since they and their customer base prefer the 45 degree V-Twin with long stroke, this is just the nature of the beast unless you go to the expense of really lightening the rotating mass.

The maximum redline is listed at 5600 for mine in the manual and 6000 for the regular 1200/883..but the rev limiter kicks in well below that...I will go flog it some more just in the ofrchance I read the tach wrong when the rev limiter kicked in. Ideally 5500 rev limiter would be perfect. I was trying to figure out why mine is listed lower than a normal 1200, not an 883.

Well after flogging it...itappears I got what I asked for..seems to cut in around 5500 ish..yay

te rev limit is artificially law because of the EPA noise standards... it hasta be a certain db (80?) at a percentage of redline (55%?)... so by lowering the redline, they pass the noise standards without having to use more restrictive mufflers...

My 04 1200R hits the stopper at 6K at about 115mph. After some mild head work and N2's it is still on the upward swing of HP at 6K when it starts the old sputter, sputter, sputter.

I once read that piston head speed on these long stroke motors is also a reason for not wanting to get to happy with the high revs. Unless your bike is really well tuned I don't suppose that 6000 rpm is really going to help you. I have my adjustable set at about 5600 because I don't think I ever needed any more revs. Apparently the rods start to stretch when the revs approach such high marks. This is probably why the chevy 350's also tach out at less than six where a bmw can go to 6500. just a thought.

again..just tryin to figure out why they said the 1200 sport was less than the regular 1200...maybe the compression difference?

I've wondered the same thing about mine as well. I really have no clue, but I did read somewhere that the S uses a lighter flywheel than other models. Makes me wonder if that makes the engine as a whole less capable of handling all that reciprocating weight.

I'm not a frequent visitor, but I'll bet you can find the answer here: http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/HDXL1200S/

Probably allows it to rev up a whole lot faster. Old tuner trick was to drill flywheels to reduce weight and thus allow engine to rev up quicker. I had a friend with a pan chopper whos flywheels looked like swiss cheese.

Beware of taking weight off the flywheel, its where the engine stores energy and also will affect tourqe output. Great for getting an engine to rev and produce BHP at high revs, like jap bikes. Not so good on a long stroke V twin engine. V twins like a big flywheel, it gets them off the line without bogging down.

If you want to rev high, buy a multi cylinder short stroke jap bike.
If you want to make a Harley rev then be prepared to spend some serious money on head mods, valve train and bottom end work.

Why not fit an 883 ignition module, then you can rev to 6K without a limiter cutting in, or perhaps an aftermarket adjustable ignition module?

Whiffy.

G'day Sprint
You'll find that it's getting around 5600 BUT the tacho is too slow :yikes

And they seem to drop the rev limiter as the ignition gets older or more used...dunno why but I noticed mine seemed to drop down to the low 5000's when I tried it again a few years ago.


My first tacho I could get it to hit the rev limiter in neutral at around the low 4000's, then I got a new one under warranty and it was a bit quicker....HD had changed electrical suppliers around '99.

The 1200S will slam the stock rev limiter easily in the lower gears.

The best fix is to go to 6800 or 7500 SE module. I'm runnin a 7500 one in mine.
I've only ever hit my rev limiter once at 7500, just 'cos it's the doesn't mean you have to test it. :frownthre


Just a note...The bottom ends of ALL 883, 1200 and 1200 S models are IDENTICAL.
Same flywheels and rods.
The only differences are pistons between 883 - 1200 and cams between 883/1200 and 1200s...the S model runs W grind cams, the same grind as in the '04/05's

2 things limit your safe rev limit...valve train mass and piston speed.

HD addressed both these issues in the Buells ...lighter pistons and lighter valves/springs.

A lighter flywheel as in the Buells makes no difference to the rev limit it just gets there quicker.


You can't fit ignition module from anything else on the S models, they run a MAP sensor ignition similar to the Twin cams.
Changing all the wiring to run a progrmable one is a step backwards as the stock one has 8, yes 8, curves depending on manifold vacuum.
Unlike the twin cams the total advance can still be adjusted by the hall sensor pick up....Best of both worlds.

G'day Sprint
You'll find that it's getting around 5600 BUT the tacho is too slow :yikes

And they seem to drop the rev limiter as the ignition gets older or more used...dunno why but I noticed mine seemed to drop down to the low 5000's when I tried it again a few years ago.


My first tacho I could get it to hit the rev limiter in neutral at around the low 4000's, then I got a new one under warranty and it was a bit quicker....HD had changed electrical suppliers around '99.

The 1200S will slam the stock rev limiter easily in the lower gears.

The best fix is to go to 6800 or 7500 SE module. I'm runnin a 7500 one in mine.
I've only ever hit my rev limiter once at 7500, just 'cos it's the doesn't mean you have to test it. :frownthre


Just a note...The bottom ends of ALL 883, 1200 and 1200 S models are IDENTICAL.
Same flywheels and rods.
The only differences are pistons between 883 - 1200 and cams between 883/1200 and 1200s...the S model runs W grind cams, the same grind as in the '04/05's

2 things limit your safe rev limit...valve train mass and piston speed.

HD addressed both these issues in the Buells ...lighter pistons and lighter valves/springs.

A lighter flywheel as in the Buells makes no difference to the rev limit it just gets there quicker.


You can't fit ignition module from anything else on the S models, they run a MAP sensor ignition similar to the Twin cams.
Changing all the wiring to run a progrmable one is a step backwards as the stock one has 8, yes 8, curves depending on manifold vacuum.
Unlike the twin cams the total advance can still be adjusted by the hall sensor pick up....Best of both worlds.

OK, so why is the redline on the Sport model (and subsequently the rev limiter) 500 RPM lower than the other models? That's the question that is being asked.

'cos it hits it harder.....and it's a hard limiter, where the standard models use a soft retarder for a limiter.


Unless you put a shift light on there the tacho is telling you lies too.

it's all acedemic in the end.... if ya hit it regular.... change it..simple..


and where did ya get 500 rpm from?????

We get 500 rpm from the owners manual where it states max RPM for the 1200 custom is 6000 and the sport at 5600..ok so 400 RPM.

I was under the impression that standard 1200 were only around the 5 1/2 mark too.

I can't recall any standard 1200 motors I've ridden goin to 6000..

Don't believe everythin HD tells you either......even they make mistakes...ask anyone with an 04 manual how much oil their engine takes :rolleyes:


Splittin a few hundred rpm at those revs is as I said accademic....whatever ya got if ya hittin the limiter easy then go to higher limiter within reason...don't go an 8000 one as ya may as well not have one.


Anyway have a beer, then we're all faster ;) :drinkbeer :drinkbeer
And who cares wether ya drunk 16 or 17 if ya drunk then ya drunk :drinkbeer :drinkbeer :drinkbeer :drinkbeer

G'day Sprint



I was just lookin at you sig...and you say you're runnin the 200 main at over 6000ft....do you have a drag strip any where near and have ya run it ???

Would seem a touch rich to my way of thinking but safe anyway.

I'm runnin a 200 main at sea level...mind you that's what my bike came with and I keep comin back to it. ......it's run 11.8@114 with that jet..

What do you have done for modifications to run that decent? Hell mine struggles to hit 114 period at this altitude. I read an article on sportster.org telling me to leave my slow jet alone but the main still needs to be increased even at high altitudes, and it pulls harder in the upper revs with the 200 vs the 195 so I left it in. I tried a 45 slow jet for giggles and it became really soft off the bottom.

We get 500 rpm from the owners manual where it states max RPM for the 1200 custom is 6000 and the sport at 5600..ok so 400 RPM.

I think your mixing up years...

-A 2003 1200S has a rev limit of 5600 rpm
-A 2004 1200 (R or C) has a rev limit of 6000

The 2004 is a very different motor - much lighter internals than your 2003 Sport model. I am not exactly sure of the 2003 models, but I do know that 2002 1200 would only rev to 5100 or 5200 rpm (I assume that the '03's are the same being the engines were identical). Your 1200S DOES rev higher than a standard 1200 from the same year. But new 1200 will rev to 6000rpm, 400 higher than you.

Keep this in mind:
A 1200S can use a S.E. Ignition module that will bring the rev limit to 7200rpm. Much higher than you need. A 2004 1200 will only get up to 7000rpm with a S.E. module. So with the ignition modules, your motor will rev higher than a 2004.

The rev limiter on the Sport model is not less than the one on the other 1200's. The 883 is the only one with a 6,000 rpm rev limit and the 1200's I think were 5200 rpms (about 400 rpms lower than the Sport).

G'day Sprint

WIth the altitude you are at you need less fuel than the rest of us 'cos ya got less air...this is why I rarely give out set jet sizes for people without asking quiet a few questions first........and contrary to the average internet experts opinion....what's right for their bike is probably NOT right for someone elses bike..



I've done a few things to the motor.... :D



SE 0.536" cams
V-Thunder chrome-moly adjustable pushrods
S&S Travel limiters
SE springs and titanium retainers
Buell pistons
Stock heads with twin cam valves and rewelded and reshaped combustion chamber
11.25:1 compression
Jims crank pin
external breather with PCV valve connected to timing plug hole
mod to oil return in rocker sandwich
Stock CV with 48, 200 and stock needle raised about 0.040" ... a few other minor mods in the carb.
K&N air cleaner and own design back plate with standard ham can

Gearbox shift detent plate reprofiled


That's about it off the top of my head.....


This was it's last guise before it got stripped down...it's going back together at 88" with a few extra goodies.

S&S rods and pin
S&S roller rockers
Millenium 88" cylinders and Huricane pistons
Andrews N9 cams
42 Mikuni as the 40 cv restricts to around 100HP and I'm aimin for more
Blueprinted gearbox internals




Good to see someones found where the 6000 came from....as far as I could recall the stock 1200 motors were no where near that....but I'm working with that many different motors it's hard to remember shit like that...'specially when ya put in Evos' at 5200 and twin cams at 5600and I'm putting together a UL 1200 at the mo which is about 4200. Most of my customers don't have standard modules anyway.


SE make 2 different modules for the S model a 6800 and 7500...both of them and the stock one ALL have the same curves....the only difference is the limiter

a 1200 u motor ? sounds like fun to me. nice thing about U's is they don't need rev limiters , they just can't breath hard enuff to over rev too high

I read on another forum (pans and flattys) that FLATHEAD POWER might be casting new cases for U's soon and it will house s&s wheels and rods , sould be good for 95 inches (god I hope so) now that would be a motor to put in a fatboy (call it flatboy)

a 1200 u motor ? sounds like fun to me. nice thing about U's is they don't need rev limiters , they just can't breath hard enuff to over rev too high


Yeah Flatty

and this is origional WITH CHAIR.

The barrels only had ONE chipped fin so I got some stepped sleeves made up and refurbished 'em.
teflon coated the pistons too. they were from a car and I had to get cute with pins...these are now held in by shrink fit..

should come together alright but I've run into trouble in gearbox already with work that has been done incorrectly before....so hopefully I won't find too many problems in putin it together.

Bit more work than a late model bike for a mechanic ...easy for an engine builder/machinist tho ;) ....as you can appreciate a lot of things have to be re machined and new parts made...but no different to puttin a race engine together...measure EVERYTHING and take ya time....second best isn't good enough... 'cos second place is the first loser :p

29 posts on this already ...

The pre 04 1200 Sportys have the rev limiter set at 5,200 rpm because the stock motor [don't] make any more power above 5,200 revs. There is no reason for H-D to set the rev limiter any higher.

It's real basic ... Why rev a bone stock pre 04 above it? ... Like in aviation terms ... Your then on the back-side of the power curve

I'm trackin..the mixup was we thought the 1200S had a lower rev limiter than the regular 1200..but my limiter is above 5500 so this all seems to be redundant...unlike the T-53s in your UH1s which could rev to the moon :)

To add..my 2003 manual STILL states the MAX rpm for the XLH1200 to be 6000 rpm(even thought it has a lower limiter)and 5600 rpm for the XL1200S(which happens to cooincide with the limiter)..this whole time we are still trying to figure out why they say the regular 2003 1200 is able to rev higher safley than the 1200S..fromt he SAME year 2003..if need be I will take a picture of the owners manual.