It was kind of an overcast and chilly morning, the sort of day, it wouldn't have mattered much if I went or not but I'd given my word the day before so off we went for a ride. I had the unshakeable feeling that something wasn't quite right and wasn't really comfortable with it but said nothing. Maybe it's just me I thought or maybe I'm just not 100% today. Feelings not withstanding, we all met for breafast and left in a group.

There were four of us. In the lead, a rider with over twenty five years experience. He was followed by a second year rider (IMHO, the most vulnerable) just getting his bones. Third was another experienced rider with me taking the back door as I most often do. Having what I feel, good road savvy, I like to keep an eye on things and riding behind is something I do better than most. One and three respectively are former MSF instructors. A couple of hundred miles later, a slight mist had gathered on my windshield and the road was just slightly damp. Not yet what you'd call wet but certainly something to pay attention to. From experience, I knew this was a high risk situation. I tend to ride conservatively anyway so I hung back a bit more than I normally would. Again, just a feeling but I've learned thru the years, to trust those quiet urgings. In the front of the whole mess was a ford pickup towing a boat.

As we approached the intersection, a flashing yellow for us and a flashing red for the cross road. Parked on the shoulder of the road, in the direction we were travelling, fifty yards from the intersection was a ten wheel dump truck. Coming from the right, another pickup. His field of vision obstructed by the dump truck, he was inching his way into the intersection and oncoming traffic. The guy in front with the boat swerved left to avoid hitting him. What followed next is something I've seen before but will never get used to. It's a sickening sight to say the least and invariably happens in a split second. One moment we were cruising at about 55mph, the next was a surreal image, reminiscent of fish floating in an aquarium. Bikes in mid air and riders were flying everywhere. All I could do was watch helplessy as I slowed to a stop. Before I could dismount, it was over. Both bikes in front were down and of course, tending to the riders was primary to anything else. In the end, neither was seriously injured. The first suffered a broken rib and the second suffered some back injuries. Both won't be riding anytime soon but it could have been a helluva lot worse.

Reconstructing the accident, here's what happened. The first rider, seeing the lead truck swerve, anticipated a potential problem. He applied his brake(s) to slow down. His rear wheel kicked out on the now slick pavement and in the blink of an eye, was well into a lowside. What he didn't know at the time (we saw it later) was, at that exact spot was an almost unperceptable trace of oil on the road (probably from diesel fuel). The dampness had drawn it to the surface and in that one spot, it was as slick as ice. For him, the die was cast. He had no manuevering time and was down in a flash. Nothing he could have done would have saved him. The second rider, seeing the low side in front of him, instinctively spiked his brake. His rear wheel began it's slide. Realizing his mistake, he released his brake but it was too late. His wheel had already broke traction and he had lost all control of his bike. Releasing the brake pitched him into a predictable and immediate highside from which there is never an escape. Violently, the bike threw him up, over, and out. Like a rag doll in slow motion, he bounced along the pavement for what seemed like forever and landed squarely on the dump truck tires, back side first, at about 25mph. Providentially, the bike didn't follow. That would have spelled for him, far more serious (if not worse) injuries. Number three in line was far enough behind not to get caught in the panic. He applied his brakes and literally slid by one and two. I suspect his MSF traing saved him. As he began his slide, he instinctively snapped his eyes to the horizon and was able to continue to a controlled stop. I won't get into the dynamics of that here. Just take my word for it. It works.

Me? I was lucky this time. I've been doing this since '59. I've seen this sort of thing more times than I care to admit. I get ribbed a lot for my conservative style and some even jokingly (?) call me a wuss and from time to time occaisionally make reference to my age. Either way, I'll always try to err on the side of caution. When I think conditions dictate, I slow down and give myself plenty of escape room. My mindset changes and I remember what an old timer told me years ago. "The only thing we have on common is the destination. Ride your own ride."

No lectures, no warnings. Just an experience shared. Take from it what you will and ride safe.

no one was hurt I hope

Thanks! I think I actualy forget sometimes that I should be careful! Must just me my age. Anyways, stories like this one help me remember, and that might save my hide someday.

Between Will's "Lessons Learned" and another person who stated somewhere on the forum to "always pretend you're invisible", I think it does make us more cautious when out on the asphalt...I'll just add a little advice I had gotten from an experienced rider when I was first starting out...for some reason, it consistently sticks in my head when I take off for a ride...he told me,

"Mike, whenever you go riding, always keep in mind, IT'S NOT IF YOU'RE GOING TO FALL, IT'S WHEN!" So each ride I go on, I try to make sure it's not the "when" time! Luckily I've only gone down a couple of times at slow speeds...have no desire to try out a high speed slide...having someone pick asphalt out of my ass just doesn't peg my fun meter!

IT'S NOT IF YOU'RE GOING TO FALL, IT'S WHEN!"

A sage piece of advice.

I'm gonna bump this up so more will read it.

Good read Will.
Thanks for the account.

Thanks for the bump back up Will. I saw this thread at work and said to my self... "too many words, can't read it now". Then promptly forgot about it.

It's a bummer to hear that someone got hurt today, but at least spreading the word around slaps a little reality into everyone elses heads and helps to keep us on your toes when we start to slack off.

Gary

Thanks Gary I agree with you. Sometimes my posts get wordy. My style tends to be narrative. For myself, I find that lectures ad nauseum and dire warnings do little good but stories make me think. If those stories help even one person to gain a little more awareness, it's worth it.

Just too long to read at work when I'm packing up to go home. Not too long to read when the time is right, thats why I was thanking you for the bump.

Gary

Thanks Gary I agree with you. Sometimes my posts get wordy. My style tends to be narrative. For myself, I find that lectures ad nauseum and dire warnings do little good but stories make me think. If those stories help even one person to gain a little more awareness, it's worth it.
Will, you did great by sharing this with us. Glad to hear the injuries weren't worse than they were, and most glad you weren't among them. No, I disagree that you are too wordy, because I think the only way to share some experiences is through the narrative format. Unfortunately, it's only us old riders who will stop and reflect on what you've written, because at some time or another we've been there. The younger riders and the newbes will look it over, say, "it will never happen to me", and go on with their lives. All to often, we will see their pictures on TV reports of an accident or in the obit column. It's sad for us today, but what did we do when we were young.............I sometimes try to forget.

Darhawk sez Unfortunately, The younger riders and the newbes will look it over, say, "it will never happen to me", and go on with their lives. All to often, we will see their pictures on TV reports of an accident or in the obit column. It's sad for us today, but what did we do when we were young.............I sometimes try to forget.

As sad but all too true commentary. Realizing that advice is "by fools not heeded and wise men not needed", I gave up lecturing years ago and can only hope that some will benefit from my stories. Thanks for your always incisive comments.

[b]Unfortunately, it's only us old riders who will stop and reflect on what you've written, because at some time or another we've been there. The younger riders and the newbes will look it over, say, "it will never happen to me", and go on with their lives. All to often, we will see their pictures on TV reports of an accident or in the obit column. It's sad for us today, but what did we do when we were young.............I sometimes try to forget.

Hmmm, wonder what classifies as 'young'? I'm 37 (as of last Friday), but have only had my xl for about 3 months...Either way, I certainly read all these scary posts assuming it COULD happen to me.

Thank you for taking the time and effort to share this with us. The idea of riding in the rain scares the willies out of me.

Either way, I certainly read all these scary posts assuming it COULD happen to me.

Here I go again.

Your best protection will be the MSF course. Don't let a few safe miles lull you into complacency. Statistics show that second year riders are at a much higher risk.

The idea of riding in the rain scares the willies out of me.

Riding in the rain is no biggie. What you need to know is the first few minutes are treacherous. That's when the road oils bleed to the top and wash to the side. Until that happens, the world's best tires are worthless.

I really appreciate the post, keeps us all on our toes, and to remember to be vigilant at all times. Glad to hear the riders were not seriously inured.

RC,

You're really shaping up as a writer....I have to say that as long as I've known you, you've always been gifted with words....seeing that here, in writing, is a whole other thing. Pretty cool!

Thanx for sharing and helping SOME of us remember that we're on 2 wheels. It makes no sense. We will ALL (repeat ALL) go down. How we ride and our vigilance while doing so is all that will save us.

My take- with NO information other than what you've shared~~

Would I be correct in assuming that rider #1 was not only following too closely, but perhaps may have also instinctively braked too hard with his foot?

Just curious...

And thanx again...

would I be correct in assuming that rider #1 was not only following too closely, but perhaps may have also instinctively braked too hard with his foot? ...

A very astute observation. I intentionally refrained from editorializing, prefering instead to wait for comment or questions such as yours.

You're correct. In spite of his many years of experience, I feel he was following a little too closely and riding a little too aggressively for conditions. I managed to avoid being involved in the accident simply by laying back a little. It's a no brainer.

It would be pure conjecture to say if he applied brakes too hard. In the abscence of traction, It doesn't take much to lock up on a slick surface.

. There's no shame in leaving a pack if you feel pressured. Always ride your own ride.

Riding in the rain is no biggie. What you need to know is the first few minutes are treacherous. That's when the road oils bleed to the top and wash to the side. Until that happens, the world's best tires are worthless.
Regardless of whether those tires are on a bike, a car or a truck!!!!!!!!!! A majority of Texas accidents occur during rain because it doesn't rain here often and the roads hold alot of oil. When the rain starts the surface is like ice. Most accidents are caused by or involve pickup trucks.

WillP, excellent post. I always read any kind of information pertaining to motorcycle accidents and post-accident analysis. I feel that there is a lesson to be learned in each one...

I also believe, as stated earlier, that given enough miles man & machine are destined to meet the pavement. I try to learn enough beforehand so that when my time comes, it will hopefully be something I can walk away from.

I am also a big believer in dressing for the crash, not for the ride, in an effort to live to fight another day. Was your friends gear (clothing) able to help them from sustaining worse injuries?

BTW, hope they have a speedy recovery.

Will, you're a great writer and I enjoy your stories, especially because they have a valuable message.
You've spelled out one of the reasons why I'm not a fan of riding in large groups. Many newer riders join 'riding clubs', but I don't enjoy large group rides, partially because I'm going out on the road with a bunch of riders I don't know. I have no idea of these people's experiences or their abilities to react under pressure, & my life could depend on their abilities. I only have a couple of riding buddies who I know are experienced & trustworthy & I never hestitate to go riding with them. I much prefer going in pairs or 3-4 people at most.
Especially for those of us who are off the road for the winter, those first few rides each spring we are particularly at risk due to our rusty skills. Maybe a reminder of this over the next couple of months as Spring approaches.
Keep up the good work!

Was your friends gear (clothing) able to help them from sustaining worse injuries?

Rider #1 was wearing one of those expensive riding suits and a full face helmet.

Rider #2 was wearing jeans and a heavy leather jacket plus a full face helmet. Neither sustained injuries as a result of pavement rash.

This is a good time to comment on all those that insist on wearins shorts during the summer.... Whaddya Nuts?

I don't enjoy large group rides, partially because I'm going out on the road with a bunch of riders I don't know.

A wise decision IMO. I got talked into a local toy run two years ago. Barely half way into it, I told my friend to be careful, that this was an accident waiting to happen. Less than a minute later, several bikes went down, two riders were air lifted to a hospital and the ride was essentially over.

No planning, no organization, too fast and inexperienced riders. The folks running it blamed the police escort. I avoid those kinds of rides like the plague.

Willpre,
Your personal experiences are always the best. What a heck of a way to end a ride. I hope your buddies will be ok soon. It is as startling to watch a friend go down, as it is to drop our own bikes. I'm glad you wern't hurt. I also, rode my first motorbike in 59 and have dropped four times. The causes were a stupid stunt, a steep grassy hill, and twice due to slick roads. I hate slick roads! You can lose it doing everything right!
Billy

Statistics show that second year riders are at a much higher risk.

Will, I had not heard this before. I am going into my second year of street riding and I have a ton more confidence then I did last spring. I will keep this quote in mind.

I am going into my second year of street riding and I have a ton more confidence then I did last spring.

I'm really glad you said that. It's that second year "tons of confidence" that gets them. Always remember... confidence is the feeling that comes just before the crash.

Willpre,
have dropped four times... I hate slick roads! You can lose it doing everything right!
Billy

My point exactly Billy. There are those times when we do everything right and can still go down. A lot of riders fail to grasp that at 55mph we're hurling thru time and space at 80 ft per second. There's no shame in having to drop it under those circumstances but we can minmize having to do that by remembering the 'no brainer creed'. When in doubt, slow down. I'd much rather hear about a low side than a high side anyday.

It's on those days when we least expect it that trouble often looms it's ugly head.

DarhawkThe younger riders and the newbes will look it over, say, "it will never happen to me", and go on with their lives. All to often, we will see their pictures on TV reports of an accident or in the obit column. It's sad for us today, but what did we do when we were young.............I sometimes try to forget.

For me it is not that I don't think it will happen to me (heck I'm only 20). I hope it will never happen to me, but there is always that chance. I have met some people with that attitude and I just can't stand to hear them say that. There is a very good chance it will happen sometime in my life and I just hope it won't be bad. I try to ride saftley and I have done a few stupid things and now that I look back on them I realize just how dumb I really was. :shhhh

I just hope you all don't see my name in the obit column.

Greg

As always ride safely and by all means take the MSF course.

I was thinking about taking the ABATE? class. I think that is the name of it.

I'm a proponent of the MSF course but they're all somewhat similar. The abate folks are pretty sharp.

Any safety course is better than none. Go for it. :clap

Iused to have a shoe and leather repair shop and seen the results of chaps in an accident and leather pants. The people that I repaired pants for were sore and bruised,the ones wearing chaps limped for a long time from back sprains cause the chaps twisted while sliding. Racing outfitts? the people wearing them walked right in and were so happy they were wearing them or they might have been hurt. And these are slow speed mishaps. I dont want to think what happens at high speeds

Hi NU VIKING. Don't recall seeing you over in the intros so I'll take this opportunity to welcome you. Thanks for reading my story.

I just joined last week. I am new to these comp :smoke :smoke utor toys but my wife is helping me figur them out. It was cool to find this site, its like going to a run and meeting new people altough when this usualy happens I get to go for a ride, campout,and offen have a nice beer buzz going at this time of night. But hey spring is comin and for now A Chat With You Peoples is cool to

"The only thing we have on common is the destination. Ride your own ride."

I am glad to see that there are others with this idea. The guy I ride with has had to stop and wait on me a couple times b/c I didn't feel comfortable with the situation...which was a heavy mist w/ damp roads. He doesn't ever complain, but it kinda made me feel like a chump. Oh well, nothing bad happened, and I am happier for it. WP, have you taken the advanced safety course? I am curious what they cover there. Maybe that horizon thing, b/c I don't know that I got that in the intermediate course.

Maybe that horizon thing, b/c I don't know that I got that in the intermediate course.

The 'horizon thing" is covered in both the basic and the experienced riders course. The difference is that in the basic course, it's fairly brief and practiced at low speed and on low powered machines while in the experienced riders course, you'll use your own bike and will be challenged more. It's a very important segment of the training.

Here's a kicker and sure to draw some comments. If you have a brake link system ( foreign bikes) that applies the front with the back, you're excused from that excercise. Most of the more experienced riders I know disconnect the linking system. It severely limits control and of course, if both brakes lock up, there's nothing you can do anyway.

Well, I took the course where we used our own bikes, and that wasn't covered...or it wasn't explained the same way. I will have to do some research on that one. Maybe it is in the book. I do remember though it being mentioned about the bikes with the brake setup you mentioned. Although, when I took my training they said they stopped giving the instruction that included locking up your brakes, is this the segment it would have been covered?

Sorry to hear about your bad day, Will. Watching a highside has got to take the wind out of ya. I am going to pass on the two year danger comment to some friends, whether it's true or not. We all need to be more careful.
Hope you are all riding again soon.

Up here it's still 19* and a foot of snow.
Bike show today in Cleveland. Yahoo

when I took my training they said they stopped giving the instruction that included locking up your brakes, is this the segment it would have been covered?

Yes but this opens up a whole new topic. There's a ton of politicing going on concerning the recent trend to water down the MSF (and other) training programs. I'm not gonna get into that here. It's too involved. The whole point is this: High speed and locked brake techniques can save yer ass. Look it up if ya don't believe me.

That being said (and here's the gist of the discussion), with proper safe riding riding technique, the percentage of time you'll lock up the brakes can be greatly minimized. I can't count the number of riders I see following too closely and/or under constant acceleration, and lane splitting at high speeds. It's all about risk taking. The basic courses will teach manuevers, potential hazards and avoidance techniques. Some will pay close attention and have good riding experiences while others will end up as statisics. It's just the way it is.

I avoided being involved in the the accident through no complicated techniques, manuevers or advanced knowledge. I merely slowed down when I felt conditions called for it. In short... I rode my own ride. Watching or being involved in a high side is an experiece you'll never forget and will have an affect on you for the rest of your days.

I am going to pass on the two year danger comment whether it's true or not.

Truth can often be in perception. Fact is unchangeable. Believe it!

That is why I always ride to the back. My favorite spot is last place and that is the best place to see anything. That has saved my butt so many times from things happening to people up front.

Maggie

p.s. Glad you were ok and sorry about your friends. How are they doing at this point?

That is why I always ride to the back. ... How are they doing at this point?

Everyone's ok. :clap Thanks for asking.

:) First..I'm glad to hear all involved are ok, and not as serious as it could have turned out....Will I enjoy and get alot of insight out of reading you "experiences" and/or stories, and an accomplished writer you are. This one brought back a couple of experiences of my own from years ago. Although true that sometimes doing everything right does'nt stop something bad from happening, but more times than not it's our OWN fault when it does...many reasons stated earlier. That is not a question weather going down will happen to me or not, cause it will, IT HAS. One of the very best pieces of riding advise I ever got was "Ride Your Own Ride" even when in a pack or group...I personally like the rear of a group, have seen some crazy S#$* from back there....you know come to think of it one can learn alot ( usually what not to do on a bike ) from riding in the back, plus it's calmer and I don't have to worry about the knucklehead next to me so much and can enjoy the scenery better. Anyway very much appreciated Will and please keep writing like you do, I need these moments in time when something makes me think this clearly and seriously on a topic that concerns my (our) life.......Mike 74xlh :smoke

Wilprevale! I'm glad to hear you didn't get hung up in there with the others. I'll say one thing, I always listen to that little voice that tells me something isn't "feeling" right about the ride or the road or whatever--it's right every time. I'm like you . . . I tend to ride on the side of caution when I hear that little warning. Glad to hear everyone is ok, though, considering what could have happened in the fog!!

Will

Great write!!!! It's sure makes me think about my Riding habits!!! Thanks!!

Truth can often be in perception. Fact is unchangeable. Believe it!

Maybe you misunderstood Will. I am, going to give (pass on) that info to my friends who have been riding for two years.

Also I agree with one of the other posts, to fast, to close, for the conditions. I read 55 mph, blinking caution light, light rain, boat in tow (ya never know whether the lights work on trailers) and BIG trucks.
We all need to slow down. I am a firm believer of a cars length distance for ever 10 mph you traveling. It's hard to do sometimes and it ticks people off sometimes and they might pass and try to squeeze in but ya should just slow down and then give them room.

Ride safe and COME on spring!

I am a firm believer of a cars length distance for ever 10 mph you traveling. Ride safe and COME on spring!
A very smart policy IMHO.

WillP,

I'm coming into this thread late but I was in Texas when you originally posted so I missed the story and accompanying advice until it moved up this morning. I just want to thank you for sharing your perspective on the accident(s) and for reminding me to put safety first. I am a second time, second year rider after taking quite a few years off to attend school, get married, start a family, and so on! I took the MSF basic course last summer and I'm with you. . . I highly recommed that course to all riders. This spring, I'm going for the "experienced" course although I certainly don't fit that category.

Well, I just want to thank you for sharing your wisdom with the group. I will heed your advice and I appreciate your analysis.

Todd

P.S. and no comments about brown-nosin' the teacher

I'm going for the "experienced" course although I certainly don't fit that category.
You will when you're finished! :laugh