Cool bikes deserve cool brakes.

The ABS technology has matured.

Please make H-D safer also in wet weather, on gravel and in everyday use.

The H-D deserves to be more than just a cool looking bike. It should be the safest too.

Please add ABS

Police bikes already have ABS. I sure would like to see it as at least an option on the rest of the models. ABS and Fuel injection would be great!

That's more technological cr:censorp that doesn't belong on XLs. Carbs and non-ABS brakes are fine.

For 2007, I hope they bring back the flat head (K model), mechanical drum brakes, 6V electrics, kick start, loose ball bearings all around, adjustable pushrods, iron cylinder heads and cylinders, fixed venturi carbs, solid core plug wires, spring solo or buddy seat, internal throttle, 2 piece handlebars, no turn signals, 18" spoke wheels, ummm.........


:D

That's more technological cr:censorp that doesn't belong on XLs. Carbs and non-ABS brakes are fine.:D
Amen To That!!!!!:banana

That's more technological cr:censorp that doesn't belong on XLs. Carbs and non-ABS brakes are fine.

For 2007, I hope they bring back the flat head (K model), mechanical drum brakes, 6V electrics, kick start, loose ball bearings all around, adjustable pushrods, iron cylinder heads and cylinders, fixed venturi carbs, solid core plug wires, spring solo or buddy seat, internal throttle, 2 piece handlebars, no turn signals, 18" spoke wheels, ummm.........


:D
Then maybe we could stop all the girls bike crap.:)

Darn tootin!

HA!

ABS? Naaah. I'd rather see a cable and drum. No valves, no bleeding, no manual needed. Geesh, am I really that old :doh ?

you can keep your abs. it sucks on cars, i sure dont want it on my bike.

Holy crap! With as soft as the stock forks are, can you imagine what ABS would feel like, should you grab too hard?!

Chris, while I love the electronics on my '06, I surely would like to have a kicker... and a few other things that you mention. ;)

Ummmmm, I'll pass on the ABS.....

Closed-loop fuel injection I could be talked into, but not the open loop system that's out now.

For 2007, I hope they bring back the flat head (K model), mechanical drum brakes, 6V electrics, kick start, loose ball bearings all around, adjustable pushrods, iron cylinder heads and cylinders, fixed venturi carbs, solid core plug wires, spring solo or buddy seat, internal throttle, 2 piece handlebars, no turn signals, 18" spoke wheels, ummm.........
Oh yeah, pre-order me one of those :roflblack

Dont forget the kick start and timing advance on the left grip.

Abs? I thought this was some fitness thread.......

-and where do you propose they hide all the necessary electronics for ABS? I'll pass. I bought a sporty because its simple and I can work on it myself for the most part.

Cheers,
Luke

I forgot the timing advance in the left grip. I was picturing manually adjusting the magneto before kicking it over ;)

That's more technological cr:censorp that doesn't belong on XLs. Carbs and non-ABS brakes are fine.

For 2007, I hope they bring back the flat head (K model), mechanical drum brakes, 6V electrics, kick start, loose ball bearings all around, adjustable pushrods, iron cylinder heads and cylinders, fixed venturi carbs, solid core plug wires, spring solo or buddy seat, internal throttle, 2 piece handlebars, no turn signals, 18" spoke wheels, ummm.........


:D
why wait till 07
mines pretty much got all that now

Well I've rode a few of the BMWs with ABS over here in Germany and I tell you what they stop a heck of a lot better especially at 100+ MPH on the autobahn or when some one pulls out in front of you on one of the back roads. Of course we general go 50 mph through town over here half the time and get people pulling out on you as well. I admit I'm not a big fan of how the extra electronics and stuff would probably end up looking like. Have to do some chrome covers or something on them. It would be nice if they could build a descent braking system inside th hub so you can't see any calipers and rotors as well.

Close loop full computer control fuel Injection, a Good thing!

ABS on anything....BAD THING!

That's more technological cr:censorp that doesn't belong on XLs. Carbs and non-ABS brakes are fine.:D
I'm with ya on that!!

No to ABS. (anti lock brake ALB?) If I want to skid I'm skidding.
No to EFI. I just figured out my carb. I know it inside and out and I like it.

With EFI your bike will be shut down with an EM pulse. Future tech… probably kill the ignition mod. also anyway.

K.I.S.S.

That should sum it up for me.

MC

With EFI your bike will be shut down with an EM pulse.

Plannin' on runnin' from some of those CHiPs some time soon, eh? :p

I don't like ABS on my car. It kinda sucks, I would rather lock up my brakes on Ice and Snow to get my car stopped. That way I can build up snow in front of my tires. Cars just don't stop on Ice and Snow with ABS.

With that said, I don't ride my bike on Ice or Snow. I do however put alot of miles on the pavement. When something runs out in front of me and I am in a panic type situation I don't want to be thinking about balancing front to rear brakes. And before you tell me that should be second nature, it may be, but, what happens when a deer is in front of me. I'm thinking about the deer. If I had ABS I could pound on my brakes and stop as fast as absolutely possible. I see this as a small way to make a dangerous hobby safer. So please, put ABS on my beloved Sportster and every other Harley. Make it an option, that way I can choose it my way, and others can choose to go without it.

Kind of like a security system. I have no need or desire for a security system. I don't even remove my key, I never use the fork lock! I live in Iowa, and unless I travel to somewhere else, I'm not worried at all!. I don't know where they hide that crap, but put the ABS there for me. I think more factory options would be better, we all get the bike we want!

I don't even have an ignition key switch on my bike. I never lock it up. If someone wants it and can figure out how to start it, they can have it.

I don't like ABS on my car. It kinda sucks, I would rather lock up my brakes on Ice and Snow to get my car stopped. That way I can build up snow in front of my tires. Cars just don't stop on Ice and Snow with ABS.

With that said, I don't ride my bike on Ice or Snow. I do however put alot of miles on the pavement. When something runs out in front of me and I am in a panic type situation I don't want to be thinking about balancing front to rear brakes. And before you tell me that should be second nature, it may be, but, what happens when a deer is in front of me. I'm thinking about the deer. If I had ABS I could pound on my brakes and stop as fast as absolutely possible. I see this as a small way to make a dangerous hobby safer. So please, put ABS on my beloved Sportster and every other Harley. Make it an option, that way I can choose it my way, and others can choose to go without it.

Kind of like a security system. I have no need or desire for a security system. I don't even remove my key, I never use the fork lock! I live in Iowa, and unless I travel to somewhere else, I'm not worried at all!. I don't know where they hide that crap, but put the ABS there for me. I think more factory options would be better, we all get the bike we want!

There is no evidence that an ABS system will stop your vehicle faster than one without. Infact, there is evidence to the contrary. The only advantage is the tires keep grip so you can control it better, make turns, etc. I don't know how much turning you can really do on a bike when you're using full-on brake. The problem is most people don't know how to react to an ABS event, and most don't know how to react to a true panic situation, so ABS, even on cars, has not been proven to actually any safer.

The only thinkg I could see on a bike is it would be nice to keep the front wheel from ever locking up. The rear is fine without.

ABS on cars is bad? That's got to be the most absurd statement I've ever read.

1976 Datsun 1200 stopped in160 feet
2005 Toyota Land Cruiser at over 5,400 pounds stopped in 141 feet.

The whole point of ABS was better control while hard braking. A car under control is better than a car in a skid any day.

i sense some apprehension here, why fear technology?

Technology is for computers and the like, not our archaic Sportster.

(I was only half kidding with my list of things to bring back for '07)....

i sense some apprehension here, why fear technology?Fear? It's not it's not fear, it's disdain. Just because someone doesn't like something why would you label it fear? I don't like celery, but I don't fear it, and I don't want anyone puttin' any on my Sporty either, yuk :laugh .

If ya want ABS get a cage. If ya need better brakes buy em! H-D makes these things as cheap as they possibly can. ABS would easily add another grand to the total cost of the bike and would drastically limit future engine modifications without doing computer upgrades. I also feel the stock brakes are fine for posted speeds and if you are exceeding the posted speeds the safety factor lies within. Mine stops fine over 100 MPH but I also have dual discs up front. Buy some decent pads and ditch the hard H-D stuff and you will get better braking if needed.
Dave
Ride to Live!

The thought of ABS on a bike scares the bejuses out of me. I've never ridden one so I don't know, but I don't want to ride a bike w/ it either.
When everything is working perfectly and your drive train is 100% stock, then ABS on a cage is okay. In my truck I think it took about 3 months before the ABS was off just enough that it worried me. Then Ford recalled the Firestone tires and I went an inch taller. That made ABS very iffy. Now I'm running 33" tires and HATE ABS W/ A PASSION!!! My Dodge Avenger never had a decent ABS and I got really lucky when I hit a pothole big enough to completely kill the ABS system.
ABS just keeps people from having to think as much when it comes time for a quick reaction. Great idea, good design, nice theory, but not consistent enough for me. In my truck if I lock the breaks I can feather out of them and then know exactly where the pedal needs to be to get max pressure w/o locking them up. W/ the ABS on there is no telling. The only option is to get completely off the break and then hit it again hoping you don't kick in the ABS, otherwise you start all over. At 60 mph I can lay about (15) 3" black marks if I stomp on my breaks and hold it till I stop. If the truck is sideways at all when the breaks disengage you're going for one heck of a ride, and can count on the breaks locking up again when you're at whatever position.

I stick w/ manual breaks.

My old boss had an SUV with ABS. While driving a patch of road that I drive everyday in my truck his SUV would not stop. I coasted through a stop sign. A bunch of old railroad tracks stopped the brakes from engaging. Yea they would have skid across the 3” of track but why the 2 feet in between. Yea, I was going to fast but my old truck can stop. Maybe ABS has gotten better this was 5-6 years ago.

So the stop sign was after the tracks? I don't understand the scenario here.

I'm guessing there was a road running parallel to the tracks and once over the tracks was a stop sign for that intersection.

Yes, the stop sign was after the tracks. It was in Alameda, CA. Tracks everywhere even down the middle of the street, many not used anymore.

Bells and whistles never made anything safer. Brains and when to use them are the answer. Kylonees just make them more fun (Hahahaha)

Fear? It's not it's not fear, it's disdain. Just because someone doesn't like something why would you label it fear? I don't like celery, but I don't fear it, and I don't want anyone puttin' any on my Sporty either, yuk :laugh .

:roflblack :roflblack :roflblack

By the looks of the vote, harleys on the right track with no ABS, besides, i feel i have good control of my own brakes, i like them the way the are.

Heres another no vote. Learn how to ride or get off the freaking road.

ABS on a bike doesn't detect side slip....


Think about it ........



While it's not a bad idea on a land barge in loose or intermittent traction...

It's NOT a substitute for an experianced rider

I'm not a fan of it on a bike... you stick it the same place as ya combined brakes ..... it may be usefull for the unintiated or slow thinking ones... but they shouldn't be on a bike in the first place....
And the problem with having something like that on a bike is idiots will rely on it in a straight line and get lazy...

Even BMW has dropped the combined brakes on the new R1250S..... might be worth lookin at a Bimmer again.. :D

Raw and simple, yup that's the way a Sportster should be.

That being said, there is a lot of interest in 'extras'. So I would like to see more 'tech' available in a Sportster version. Not everybody wants a loaded BT, but maybe one or two or three or... 'features' would make it to most Sporty's. :banana :banana :banana

I know that I would like an on-board sound system that doesn't 'overload' the looks of the Sporty

I'm a huge believer in technology.

I prefer EFI to carbs and my last 3 personal bikes have all had EFI, though obviously my wife's sporty has a carb. Actually it's the ONLY carb in the house (unless you count the lawn tractor).

I've even had a bike with ABS already. It wasn't bad. Except that even BMW (which is what is was) seems to constantly have teething pains.

The early BMW ABS systems would fry the module if the battery got too low (voltage spikes at start-up) OR at the very least would go into diagnostic mode and you wouldn't have ABS anyway (though you'd be treated to flashing lights on your dash for the whole ride).

Later versions were integrated with whining servos and reportedly other problems.

No thanks, I like ABS on my cars, but I don't want it forced on my bikes.

Kev

Seems anti-lock brakes would a much better idea on a four-wheeled vehicle. I would rather not skid and have the chance to maneuver.

But on two wheels, hard braking really, really degrades steering. (Well, it does in a car, too, but the car isn't going to fall over.) Braking should be accomplished entering the turn, but sometimes you have to brake in a turn for whatever reason. But braking too hard causes the bike to go down. (The effect reminds me of aerodynamic stall.)

Maybe there's an advantage if you wanna slam on the brakes while traveling in a straight line, but I think ABS on a bike would only encourage riders to slam on the brakes whenever they're in a jam.

for abs to work properly on a bike you need a few things, module,pump,lines,yaw sensor,wheel speed sensors,extra brake line,steering angle sensor...thats a lotta shit to go bad. and probably expensive. also the added weight has to be figured in and mounting location.

ABS can make a big difference if you have to do an emergency breaking. But most bike-ABS do not work as good as on a car and it adds a lot of weight to a bike.

I suggest that HD would make a Sporty with say only some 200kg instead of the kg270+ of the 2006 models .... :rolleyes:

There is no evidence that an ABS system will stop your vehicle faster than one without.

Sure there is, but everyone who has a dog in the hunt manipulates the data for their particular bias. The insurance industry looks at $ losses and interprets the numbers to undervalue ABS so they can stop discounting policies for cars equipped with ABS. The ABS manufacturers (Boschi, Delphi, et al.) produce their own studies and (no surprise) ABS is shown to be remarkably effective.

The much (too) cited HLDI study, years ago, only looked at 1000 accidents over a 10 year period when ABS was still an emerging technology. There are now millions of cars on the road with ABS and a whole new universe of data to sort through.

Other, more recent studies have found that vehicles equipped with four-wheel ABS systems were involved in 2,800 fewer frontal impacts (a category that accounts for 82% of the crashes analyzed by the NHTSA).

The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) said the HLDI report findings may be explained by several factors: that drivers who are unfamiliar with ABS may not keep their foot on the brake or may pump the pedal during a panic stop, reducing the effectiveness of the ABS system. ABS may also give some drivers a false sense of security, possibly encouraging them to drive more aggressively and run off the road. Basically (and the truth hurts), they're saying drivers are STUPID. Who's going to argue with that? It may be more charitable to say they're "untrained".

About 10 years ago, I had a chance (actually was required for my job) to take an aggressive driving safety course to practice high-speed pursuit safety techniques. We also had a chance to work with cars on the skidpad both with and without ABS, and believe me, it made a helluva lot of difference in stopping and CONTROL having ABS in the cars. The fact that you can still read, to this day, threads on auto sites where people post problems about the brakes vibrating during a panic stop or on slick surfaces tells me most drivers still don't have any experience with ABS (and are most likely to pull their foot off the pedal).

Would I want ABS on a bike? Hell, yeah. And it's showing up more an more -- even the big Suzuki Burgman scooters (actual scooters) offer ABS.

Leave the ABS on the cagers, give us the option of EFI or carb, but Geez do something about that sub-standard suspension that we all have to change.:(
Wagondog

give LOL....:banana :roflblack :roflblack :roflblack :roflblack

-and where do you propose they hide all the necessary electronics for ABS? I'll pass. I bought a sporty because its simple and I can work on it myself for the most part.

Cheers,
Luke

:chtwo Cheers, you said it all for me.

give LOL....:banana :roflblack :roflblack :roflblack :roflblack
"give" wasn't the best choice of words:doh
Wagondog

They can add whatever they want....I STILL won't buy a Sporty newer than 02..... :)

dont want abs, because to me the sportster is simple. low tech. raw rude and crude. basic and a whole lotta fun. just the way i like it.

I used to have Ab's..... then I got old and lazy

ABS....WTF.... I don't want a rear brake...Id rather stop my ride like Fred Flintstone does.....with his !!!:censor ingn bare feet...:smoke

I've been keeping an eye on this pole since I joined the forum.
Here goes: I think the only issue with the ABS thing is will you still be able to lock it up and go down low in the event that you have to save your life. Now that's a maneuver that only those of us that had to do it, may appreciate. I went under a semi truck trailer. It isn't pretty being the brake pad but I didn't die. So I didn't vote. Besides I already have a bike without ABS, EFI and for that matter a battery. My magneto is fully advanced, I got 10.5 compression and 77 cubic inches. So the rest of you folks ride what you will and leave us technophobic, entry level, girl's bike riders alone.

you can keep your abs. it sucks on cars, i sure dont want it on my bike.


You got that right! :smoke Just 1 more thing that could go wrong :doh
http://xlforum.net/photopost/data/500/medium/100_0946smaller.jpg

Lotsa extra crap with ABS, plumbing,electronics, etc. They'd be better off to take 50 lbs off the bike and bring the brakes,tires and suspension up to, oh, 1984 standards or so. Think the Sportster has good brakes? Ride a Buell sometime.The ABS may be partly to lure unskilled dorks onto motorcycles. The safer the bike is perceived to be, the more people may buy. The other thing is consumers LOVE TECHNO GADGETS. Look at all the useless crap on modern SUV's for example. Tell people long enough what they want and they will want it.

I have anti-lock brakes on my 06 1200R embeded in my right fingers and right foot. Works real good.

Count me on the side of HD offering ABS as an option. I would pay extra for it. Heck, HD already puts self canceling signals on their bikes. ABS is just a natural technological progression, or is that evolutionary progression.:smoke

I'm glad we're only arguing about ABS right now....

If the newest Goldwings are any indication, will we someday be arguing over whether or not HD should install airbags on the new 2017 water-cooled Sportster models?? :doh

The problem with ABS on bikes is that they sometimes fail. Ask a BMW owner about this. And when they do, you have a completely different feel to the braking system, not to mention a completely different technique. If this happens during an emergency stop, you are toast. Also, ABS is programmed to onle give a percentage of maximum braking to the wheels. In other words, you can stop FASTER with normal brakes if you are good.

Forget it. I would not want that on my bike.

BmW bikes have ABS....????

to adding new technology to the old bike, such as progressive rate shocks and springs right out of the box! Oh wait, that's not new technology. Why are they sooooo sloooow about the simple shit?

Sorry, but this is BS. If ABS should fail, the brakes would work just like any other braking system. And the percentage of maximum braking? 100%, only when a wheel would lock up it releases the brakes, just to re-aply 100% again a split second later. With normal brakes you can never apply 100%, or you'd be flat on your back.


No matter how good you are, I'll put my money on the ABS anytime. Especially in a crisis situation, when it counts.
You are correct I have been working on cars with ABS for years. The computer can keep the tire at about 80% lockup better than any person. 80% is the max stopping power w/o locking up. The key is to keep steady pressure on the lever or pedal.

ABS is messing with NATURAL SELECTION {allowing brain dead drivers to get away with actions that should have punch thier ticket}.


ABS does not work at slow speeds {below 10 mph I believe}...so the wet leaves will still have thier way with you.

Well, that all depends on which scale you measure it:) From nought to skidding or from nought to the maximum capacity of the brakes itself. But that last one varies with the amount of weight on it, if there's little or no weight on the wheel it could luck up far more easy then when it bears a heavy load.

That's why I disagree about keeping steady preasure, that would mean you don't use the maximum amount of stopping power.
On a bike without ABS, the best way to perform an emergency brake would be to:
Slam the rearbrake. The most weight is on the rear wheel, so you don't have to worry about skidding as much. Just be sure to steadily decrease the amount of braking.
As the weight shifts forward because of the breaking, increase the forward brake. Move forward a bit, more weight means you can brake harder. Keep increasing 'till you've com to a complete stop. Just be sure to have decreased the rearbrake enough to not lock it up.

Well, that's the theory behind it. It also depends on the surface, rider position etc. Forward controls on a Sportster mean there's little weight on the front wheel, so the prolonged use of the the rear brake would be more effective then decreasing rear->increasing front. But the more you come to a n actual stop, the trickier it will be to handle.

It would have cost me € 1500 to replace the damaged parts on my bike if I gave a crap about scratches and stuff. 5 mph, wet leaves and a "stop" sign is enough to lock up your brakes and have your helmet wedged in between the street and a car tyre. That got me thinking ABS isn't such a bad thing after all:tour
If you don't keep steady pressure on the pedal the ABS will not work! the Isolation dump valves won't work if the wheel is not close to locking up so then you would be back to base brakes. The time it takes for a person to think about what you need to do. The ABS computer will be doing whats needed!:banadanc

If you don't keep steady pressure on the pedal the ABS will not work! the Isolation dump valves won't work if the wheel is not close to locking up so then you would be back to base brakes. The time it takes for a person to think about what you need to do. The ABS computer will be doing whats needed!:banadanc

Hell yes... I did a BMW Advanced Driver training course with a BMW M3 at a race track, they get you to drive down the front straight at 60kmh, which they have wet down.. Over the radio the instructor will yell at you to 'STOP!', when he does you have to do your best to stop... With the ABS OFF.

They do this a few times, you feel like you are starting to do it pretty well, feeling a bit like a hero.

Then they switch ABS on and you do the run... Bang! the car just STOPS, SO much shorter than the best attempt without ABS.. SO MUCH SHORTER... Its insane.

I asked 'are you going to teach us how to brake better?' their answer is no, you will NEVER outbrake ABS is an EMERGENCY situation, never, don't care how good you are.. If that truck pulls out in front of you in the wet, don't care if you are Michael Schumacher (sp?!!).. You will not out brake the ABS.

It was such an eye opener, ABS is awesome :clap

Hell yes... I did a BMW Advanced Driver training course with a BMW M3 at a race track, they get you to drive down the front straight at 60kmh, which they have wet down.. Over the radio the instructor will yell at you to 'STOP!', when he does you have to do your best to stop... With the ABS OFF.

They do this a few times, you feel like you are starting to do it pretty well, feeling a bit like a hero.

Then they switch ABS on and you do the run... Bang! the car just STOPS, SO much shorter than the best attempt without ABS.. SO MUCH SHORTER... Its insane.

I asked 'are you going to teach us how to brake better?' their answer is no, you will NEVER outbrake ABS is an EMERGENCY situation, never, don't care how good you are.. If that truck pulls out in front of you in the wet, don't care if you are Michael Schumacher (sp?!!).. You will not out brake the ABS.

It was such an eye opener, ABS is awesome :clap
Thanks for the back up, the ABS will out preform a foot every time! Although if you are driving like a Idiot nothing will help! Abs is one more thing we can count on to help with the deer and cages! RIDE SAFE!!!:banadanc

On a bike without ABS, the best way to perform an emergency brake would be to:
Slam the rearbrake. The most weight is on the rear wheel, so you don't have to worry about skidding as much. Just be sure to steadily decrease the amount of braking.
As the weight shifts forward because of the breaking, increase the forward brake. Move forward a bit, more weight means you can brake harder. Keep increasing 'till you've com to a complete stop. Just be sure to have decreased the rearbrake enough to not lock it up.

Taken the MSF lately, ever? 70% of your braking power comes from the front brake. The only thing "slamming" the rear brake is going to do is lock up the back wheel and send you out of control. Using the front brake shifts the weight foward. That's why your fork compresses when using the front brake.

...but hey, don't take my word for it, just ask you local MSF instructor.

Cheers,

Luke

Amen melcheld the other night a cage pulled out in front of me in a construction zone, pulled the front hard hit the rear a little to hard and locked down the rear wheel started bouncing like a ball, my racing exp came in handy as i lifted off the rear and stayed on the front, the cage saw me and stoped I was able then release the front brake and swerve around the front of the car about 1 foot off the yellow lines! When on the other side all I could do was shake my head and praise the Lord for his protection!:banadanc

Ihad abs brakes on my bmw . they suck.

Ihad abs brakes on my bmw . they suck.

Was it first gen ABS? 'cos I had an R1150R and the ABS was invisible, you never knew it was there until you used it.. Was brilliant, only took one emergency stop in the wet to make me realize just how good they are.

ABS. I don't think I want it, But some others might, Make it an Option or a Add-On.

Do the big Sport bikes have ABS ???

ABS. I don't think I want it, But some others might, Make it an Option or a Add-On.

Do the big Sport bikes have ABS ???

BMW K1200S, HP2, K1200R all do.. And they are all fast as !!!!!!! bikes, some of the Japanese bikes do, but I don't really follow them..
I guess keeping in mind BMW is probably 5 years ahead of everyone else technology wise ABS will become the standard eventually..

Have no fear of technology! Seriously, on all the BMWs I've ridden with it its totally transparent, you don't know its there.. And you can on some of the models turn it off anyway!

Ah, remember the past fears... 'more than 1 cylinder!! Who needs that?!!'.. 'yarrrrr.. them watercooled motorsickles are the devils work yarrrrr...'. Then 'Pfft, fuel injection.. more like FOOL injection, it'll never take off'... emmmmmbrace!

no way jose,if thay put that kinda crap on my bike i wont be doin any fancy skidding stunts on local gravle roads:rolleyes:

no way jose,if thay put that kinda crap on my bike i wont be doin any fancy skidding stunts on local gravle roads:rolleyes:

I dunno man.. this does ok and has ABS..

http://www.conti-tyres.co.uk/contibike/images/HP2.jpg

A Sporty is like a throwback Hot Rod. Keep it simple! Just something else to screw up. I've already replaced my front brake light switch 3-times in 6 years. They would most likely gouge you on replacement parts for ABS.

Abs :doh , I don't think so. Remember with more bells and whistles comes more failures and more things to repair. keep it simple when I put on my brakes I would like them to try and stop my forward motion, not continue to roll like my Chevy van does when it slides the tires, peddle goes all the way to the floor and scares the hell out of ya. Dammet I hate when that happens!!!:smoke

I don’t need a lot of bells and whistles, but I would choose ABS if it were an option. I like things simple and sometime technology makes things better. At the risk of starting another debate over which is better, I think electronic ignition is a good example. If I never own another vehicle with points that will be all right with me. Let my old dwell meter gather dust. Today’s Sportster is just safer more reliable than it was twenty years ago. Don’t get me wrong I would own an old Sportster any day of the week.

They can make it an option. If you want it, you get it. In general most H-D owners are resistant to change. Their first knee replacement at age 57 might have them re-thinking about electric start. I test rode the BMW R1200S last summer. I hammered the brakes very hard (the Telelever adds confidence to be abusive on an unfamiliar machine) and could not tell it had ABS as it never came on - just like it's supposed too unless the tires lock up. Their system only adds 3.3 lbs.. I see why most police departments globally are going to the BMW R1200RT. They often don't have choices in clean pavement responses and ABS has drastically reduced their crashes. It being 200 lbs. lighter than the H-D's helps in the handling department also.

That's what happened here.

.. I see why most police departments globally are going to the BMW R1200RT. They often don't have choices in clean pavement responses and ABS has drastically reduced their crashes. It being 200 lbs. lighter than the H-D's helps in the handling department also.


From the Austin American-Statesman
Monday, December 04, 2006
The distinctive Harley-Davidson muffler rumble that has followed law-breaking motorists in Austin for decades will soon be replaced with a quieter German-engineered hum.
A few years ago, the Austin Police Department decided it needed anti-lock brakes on its motorcycles to improve officer safety. But because Harley-Davidson didn't offer the option at the time, officials looked elsewhere.

That's what happened here.
From the Austin American-Statesman
Monday, December 04, 2006
The distinctive Harley-Davidson muffler rumble that has followed law-breaking motorists in Austin for decades will soon be replaced with a quieter German-engineered hum.
A few years ago, the Austin Police Department decided it needed anti-lock brakes on its motorcycles to improve officer safety. But because Harley-Davidson didn't offer the option at the time, officials looked elsewhere.

Yep. Sort of hard to ignore the high-performance application of a 110hp/600lb. police bike vs. a 90/hp 800 lb. police bike, and when the crap hits the fan, honking out at 90-135 mph on a variety of surfaces, the big H-D is out of it's design element.

i don't have abs i have rolls!

I always thought the whole idea of a Sportster, ever since the K model and XLCH days, was to have a very simple, very raw, very basic motorcycle...just an engine, a gas tank, some wheels, a frame, a seat and not much else. That's the whole charm of the bike for me and always has been. There's much to be said for ABS, but when you consider just how much ordinary, everyday parts from HD cost, I shudder to think what they's charge for ABS. Plus, ABS does not work very well on dirt. I would prefer to modulate my own brakes. I like control, not things that take control away from me. I would much sooner HD take a lesson from Honda and concentrate on minor improvements to keep making little things better, such as getting rid of the silly plastic things that hold the sidecovers on and replacing them with something more substantial. Having plastic on a Sportster is kinda like having one of those new Ford/Jaguar things with fake wood panelling on the dash....not quite the real thing.

.... Yep... what Simon said.

I like my bike old skool.....

Ww

The idea of ABS sounds valid, but I've never liked the ABS's in any of the cars I've driven, specifically in snowy or wet conditions. I definitely would not want it on my Sporty.

Studies have shown that ABS often cause accidents that may have been prevented with standard brakes. The normal tendency with ABS is to release the brakes once the ABS system engages. You need to practice with ABS brakes whether on a car or a bike. Then again you need to practice emergency braking on you bike on a regular basis, If you aren't then ABS probably won't help you and if you are you probably know the limits of your braking system.

Cool bikes deserve cool brakes.

The ABS technology has matured.

Please make H-D safer also in wet weather, on gravel and in everyday use.

The H-D deserves to be more than just a cool looking bike. It should be the safest too.

Please add ABS
Next you'll be asking for an airbag!

I don't think the vibration from an ABS brake system would be very much fun on a Sporty, especially at high speed. I agree that practicing with the standard brake system is the only way to go. You're on a motorcycle and should take the extra time to learn how to safely and efficiently stop your bike. ABS has been added to cars for those unaware of how to stop correctly in an emergent situation.

I don't mind the fuel injection on bikes and I think it has it's place. I'm glad I've ended up with a bike with a carb at this point though.

Cool bikes deserve cool brakes.

The ABS technology has matured.

Please make H-D safer also in wet weather, on gravel and in everyday use.

The H-D deserves to be more than just a cool looking bike. It should be the safest too.

Please add ABS
There may a place for ABS on the touring models but not our beloved Sportster.
This is the worst idea for a Harley Sportster ever!

Sí, yo opino que hay que aprender a andar en moto y todo lo que eso implica a tener que tener implementos tecnológicos que merman nuestra capacidad de respuesta y nos hacen torpes como a los automovilistas.

(I agree with jnlee3!)

Are you nuts? ABS would put you in a high-side skid. You'd be launched over your handlebars before you could figure out what to do to correct it!

No thanks!!!!!

I had the option of ABS on my ST1300 I elected to purchase a non abs version. They stop better. Personally I love technology and waited for EFI in a Sporty. A Sporty does need serious help in the brake side of the equation. ABS is not the solution in this case. Bigger brakes is.

A defensive riding and not going too fast is the solution to the breaks issue. Concerning that, you know that a Sportster has too much mass and inertia and certainly the breaking system is not the best around here.

I haven't proved any ABS system, but surely withouth it, you can control your vehicule in a more accurate way. Learning how to stop is just as an ART as taking a turn.

I just installed a Dyna brake caliper, stainless brake lines and Lyndell Z-Plus pads. Finally I have front brakes that could take advantage of ABS. From the factory it was NSB (Not Stopping Brakes)

AW

That's more technological cr:censorp that doesn't belong on XLs. Carbs and non-ABS brakes are fine.
:D

I couldn't agree more !!!

Although I am keen on the idea of floating rotors and differential bore pistons, going to a larger rotor wouldn't hurt either..

Today's Brakes are much improved over those from the 70's ! Compounds are much better as a result of computers being as powerful as they are today. the eXotic compounds weren't around back in the day. things were done trial and error..

ABS or even better the newer style ,VDC (vehicle dynamic control) are great on todays CAGES !!! Brake Assist, Brake distribution Control, great with 4 wheels that do NOT rely on Gyroscopic Action....

More bells & whistles doesn't mean better. I like the comments about higher quality, better balanced components.

You want more b&ws, buy a goldwing...:geek:geek:geek

PLEASE do NOT put ABS on the HD bikes!!! I can stop just fine, and would rather not have one more thing to break that I am unable to service myself...

the sportster is one of the rawest and realist bikes that hd makes and it is bada** the way it is to add abs and electronics would only make it conform to all the standards that the "man" is trying to enforce.

Cool bikes deserve cool brakes.

The ABS technology has matured.

Please make H-D safer also in wet weather, on gravel and in everyday use.

The H-D deserves to be more than just a cool looking bike. It should be the safest too.

Please add ABS


I AGREE !!! ABS on my BMW with their combined front and rear braking with the front lever allows me to stop faster in an emergency ... basically grab the front brake as hard as you can ... no swerving ... no need to worry about modulating the brakes to prevent lockup ... full concentration can be used to avoid the obstacle ahead !

ok you guys talking about timing advance on left grip your showing your age, as far as a b s we don't need no stinking abs . i to would rather skid to a stop.:doh :doh :doh

ok you guys talking about timing advance on left grip your showing your age, as far as a b s we don't need no stinking abs . i to would rather skid to a stop.:doh :doh :doh


On your ass ??? :rolleyes:

man , I had a long azz rant all typed up and hit the wrong key and lost it all

but the jist was " learn how to drive , don't let the car do it for ya (or bike)

technology fails. ever wonder why planes have triple redundancy systems, cause they know its gonna fvck up

and noone is gonna pay for the cost of triple redundancy cars

On a dresser, 800+lbs, generally older riders....Sure ABS may make some sense.

On a "sport" type bike, where many purchse them for the raw performance characteristics....Nope. Leave it alone, put good brakes on it and let the rider actually control his machine.

Mav

(Who still drives RWD cars with no ABS as well)

If you want ABS it's an option on the 08 touring bikes... where it belongs.

Leave the XL alone, It adds weight, you want that crap buy a GW

I can see my two upper sets of abs

i am sitting at home out of work for at least 3 months because i got on the back brake too hard in a panic stop/slow down in a slight curve on an interstate on ramp. my fault for being to close to a car trying too exit just ahead? yes. my fault for not getting on the front brake enough? yes. wishing that back brake didn't lock up now? HELL YES.

Forget all that Crap........

I could understand ABS on a big bagger but, on a sporty? No Way!

Make it an option if you want it but NOT STANDARD.
Back pegs, a good front and rear seat, back shocks that carry a passenger with ease yes, but no ABS.
Since when is it unsafe to ride without it? When newbies tell us we need it?
Learn to ride for real, this is not a video game.

I like feeling the same things that I felt with the dirt bikes in the 80's when the front or rear tire(s) lock up or lose traction. It doesn't happen often as I have matured a little bit, but you can keep the technology that controls the bike for you. I hated the traction control on my '95 z-28. I don't want abs or traction control on my bike. I will ease off the throttle to keep my wheel from spinning, and I don't want abs to control my braking. I will and do control both very well myself without help, thank you very much.
Ask any pilot that has flown the early fighters, and the newer fighters. It isn't the same. I want to ride my bike. I don't want the computer to do it for me.:D

i am sitting at home out of work for at least 3 months because i got on the back brake too hard in a panic stop/slow down in a slight curve on an interstate on ramp. my fault for being to close to a car trying too exit just ahead? yes. my fault for not getting on the front brake enough? yes. wishing that back brake didn't lock up now? HELL YES.

Driver error. Would abs absolve you from not keeping proper/safe distance or knowing how to react to that situation? NOPE. Panic and lack of training/experience YEP.

no ABS please.. and no airbags.. what has happened to motorcycles?

It's coming. Get used to it or plumb around it but you are going to pay for it.

AW

ABS scared the shit outta me on the newer BMWs, I cant imagine how the HD version would be. its kinda wierd to have the back brakes work the front too.

i sense some apprehension here, why fear technology?

It's not the technology, it's-
The unecesary cost
The loss of choice
The more costly repairs, parts, and labor.
Loss of the ability to maintain yet another part of my bike myself

The benefits just don't outweigh the BS for me.

It's not the technology, it's-
The unecesary cost
The loss of choice
The more costly repairs, parts, and labor.
Loss of the ability to maintain yet another part of my bike myself

The benefits just don't outweigh the BS for me.

Do you still have points on your wifes car? Do you stll have a knob for the choke on her car?

Just asking questions

AW

Vintage Sportster lovers are buying the new generation Sportsters with enthusiasm. H-D must be doing something right.

Why continue to build a vintage bike with little technological features, when there are thousands of them on the used market for purists to purchase.

You like old stuff? Buy old stuff! You like the new stuff? Buy new stuff?

Harley Davidson was 25 years behind in technology on the Sportster. If they failed to change course, sales for new Sportsters would cease. It happens to any product that is self propelled.

Billy

'ell no. I hate a system doing my job when I can handle it fine. I've never owned a car with ABS or traction control and never had a problem. My vehicle at work is a different story. These systems make me feel MORE out of control if such a situation woud arise as it had with the work vehicle

I've never riden (a bike) with abs I dont much care for it in cars
But I read that the '09 line up is gonna be full of abs the sporty's 2 I dont know how reliable the info was either hd forum or v twin forum i think

Here is the results from this weekends autocross. Granted these are cars but look at the times that these computer controlled cars are turning. In those results, the car classes that end is S are all cars that really are as delivered new from the dealer. My son was 13th, driving a 1985 Honda Civic. His car has no computers but none the less worth about $30000 in parts alone. Computers work.

Note: the column titled "Total" is the raw course time.

http://www.stlsolo.org/tabid/55/itemid/174/Event-5-Index-Results.aspx

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3181/2665922458_7a82a833ec.jpg

AW

The "theory" behind all of these electronic assists for driving/riding are worthy. What's NOT ACCEPTABLE, is increasingly, people tend to learn even less about "skills", just relying on the machine do it for them. Young folks today don't care if they crack a car up - they have twenty airbags and ride in a mini-car "tank" that weighs an incredible 3,000 lbs., so they feel invincible. Back-up cams are popular because instead of learning to back into driveways like a responsible adult, folks can rely on a camera to show them there is not toddler crawling around the back when they pull out to leave in a mad rush (my own sister-in-law has NEVER, in over 30 years, backed their car out of the garage - she CAN'T DO IT!). At least 90% of all drivers, perhaps even more, SLAM ON their brakes in emergencies, losing maximum braking and all vehicle control. ABS is another system that solves learning how to drive in the first place. Heck, we even now have vehicles that automatically parallel park - a person who can not even park a car should NOT be issued a license, PERIOD! Our system continually rewards and enables the "inept" to get behind the wheel - fully licensed to kill, just like 007.

Personally I think ABS isnt needed, especially since I can't lock the brakes on my Sportster to begin with, of course I also feel my car would be better with no fuel injection, no abs, no seat belts, no mushy dash covering, no crumple zone, and bring back driving the rear wheels and manual transmissions, but what do I know I only run em for 500,000 miles or so anyhow :frownthre

Sorry I think ABS on a bike is an incredibly BAD idea, it is a proven fact that an experienced driver can stop in a shorter distance without ABS. Add to that the jackhammer effect it would have on the front forks, no thanks!

Sorry I think ABS on a bike is an incredibly BAD idea, it is a proven fact that an experienced driver can stop in a shorter distance without ABS. Add to that the jackhammer effect it would have on the front forks, no thanks!

Mister T, I'd like to see some of that "proof" if you don't mind !

as far as the "jackhammer" effect ... you obviously haven't ridden a bike with a good ABS system on it ... it isn't so .

ABS has saved my ass more than once on a bike ... and as far as experience goes I do 20,000 kms a season ... and started riding 40 years ago.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Zv3Sacl7JQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3d6iu-1WFxw&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z5lhtDUcCj0&feature=related



The differance is basically as clear as in the first video link.

Howard

Several years ago Austin ditched their HDs and went to BMWs specifically because HD didn't offer ABS at the time. One of our friends is an APD motor patrol. He tells me ABS is great, that he has daily instances that reinforce that feeling. Just one man's opinion FWIW.

Personally I think ABS isnt needed, especially since I can't lock the brakes on my Sportster to begin with, of course I also feel my car would be better with no fuel injection, no abs, no seat belts, no mushy dash covering, no crumple zone, and bring back driving the rear wheels and manual transmissions, but what do I know I only run em for 500,000 miles or so anyhow :frownthre

Have you tried locking the brakes on your bike with a little sand , gravel, water or oil on the road surface ???

Howard

Have you tried locking the brakes on your bike with a little sand , gravel, water or oil on the road surface ???

Howard

you dont. in the wet or loose surfaces the front brake is not my first option. motor, dabbing the rear and a clear line of sight works best.

ABS on a big touring bike - fine. On a stripped down, lane-splittin' Sporty? No way.

For me a big part of riding a motorcycle is being connected to the machine. I already have a minivan, don't need a two-wheeled one.

KongBastard

I don't think I'd want ABS but I'd sure like to have better front brakes! I think they should make dual front rotors standard on all sportsters. With all the modern technology available there is no excuse for crappy brakes!

you dont. in the wet or loose surfaces the front brake is not my first option. motor, dabbing the rear and a clear line of sight works best.

All of the above makes sense in normal conditions ... if a car comes out of a lane in front of you and cuts you off ( and this is only one of hundreds of possible scenarios ) you no longer have the choice to use only decompression or "dabbing' the rear my friend !

After 40 plus years of on and off road riding I wouldn't want abs on any bike that I was riding. At this point the braking is done by feel subconsiously and I really dont think abs would improve any aspect of my riding. I guess if I was new to the sport I might need all the help I could get but I am not.

ABS on the rear would make sense to me. In a panic stop, the rear can lock up pretty easy and then the back of the bike wants to come around.

If ABS would allow the bike to stay straight in a panic rear brake stop, I would like to see it as an option.