Ironhead cam trouble's

[timberjack]

I have a new cam chest cover and it come with the bushings installed.I installed new cam bearings aswell i purchased andrews pb+ cams when i install them and put the cover on they seem stiff to turn.I put my used p cams in and put the cover on and i can spin them nicely.I can turn them nice at either end of cams by just turning one when the pb's are in the case cover but they stiffen up to the point i turn them a revolution or so and then i cant spin them no more with the cover on.If they needed to be reamed why do the old cams seem so perfect fit in there spinning free and with about the right side to side play that i would expect.

Does this mean i am going to have to send them back so they can put them on the broach machine? errr this is frustrating why sell cams if they need to get sent back.very frustrated!!

[nikki]

Originally Posted by timberjack

I have a new cam chest cover and it come with the bushings installed.I installed new cam bearings aswell i purchased andrews pb+ cams when i install them and put the cover on they seem stiff to turn.I put my used p cams in and put the cover on and i can spin them nicely.I can turn them nice at either end of cams by just turning one when the pb's are in the case cover but they stiffen up to the point i turn them a revolution or so and then i cant spin them no more with the cover on.If they needed to be reamed why do the old cams seem so perfect fit in there spinning free and with about the right side to side play that i would expect.

The p cams are worn so the shafts fit lose in the bushings the pb+ cams are new so they are tighter and the bushing need to be line bored to fit size of the new cans . Nikki

[doodah man]

Originally Posted by nikki

The p cams are worn so the shafts fit lose in the bushings the pb+ cams are new so they are tighter and the bushing need to be line bored to fit size of the new cans . Nikki

+1 with nikki. there was a discussion on this a few months ago that said to the effect, you may be able to take the new cams and new cover to a local machine shop and have them center bore each cam bushing enough for them to spin free and be just fine, however the "correct" way is to have them line bored, which means cases split and ream with the correct tools.

[chevelle]

Is there anything wrong w/ the P's?
I have seen no increase in power w/the pb+.
If you are set on running the Andrews you will need to pinpoint your problem cam(s).
Swap them in one at a time until you pinpoint the problem.
The Andrews gear dia. should be small enough to just install, but you may need to measure and call to see if they have any to trade.
On the 2&4 there are 2 gear sets to complicate things.
The factory p's have about 8 different sizes per gear, that's thousands of combinations to get the fit right.

[billeuze]

I'm with chevelle on this one. If your new cover needed line boring then your old cams would not spin freely. So to use your new cams you would have to determine which gear(s) is too big and send it in to Andrews to put on the Broach machine.

But if you've got good P cams just use them and sell your new PB+. The PB+ is an upgrade from the later Q cams but they aren't that much diferent than the old Ps. Someone here dyno tested and found the PB+ no better thanthe Ps. (Might have been chevelle).

[beardo]

Now this brings up a question for me. I have a set of P's and PB+'s. The PB's have much larger and wider lobes than on the P's. Are there different P's?

[timberjack]

Niki- yes but my p's arn't worn i mic'ed em and they are the same as the andrews, and my p's will spin free.So i wondered if it had to do with gear length on the cams or just what is goin on.

doodah man - my cases are split I have looked for the proper tool in canada and cant seem to find one, not sure of anyone in my area who can do this type of thing.

chevelle- i think the p's seem to be fine, I deff agree i need to figure this out if i want to run these cams i have tried swaping them and even if i have one andrews cam on when i install the cover i cannot turn the cam by fingers, let alone check for clearance.
ahh that clears it up a bit why they "andrews" cant just make it right,thanks.

billeuze- yha, i will probly just use my p's hate to not use a performance upgrade specially after its purchased and in hand, i maen i can see the diff in lobe shape by the eye and of course read what it is and that it is indeed a lil bigger then the p's .But thats probly what i will do is ebay em i dont know i purchased them form legends and prolly cant ship em back across the border.Aswell i agree the diff is very small and maybe it wouldnt or doesnt make anymore power.

so even if they were lined bored this problem would still be there as they would just be really wearing the bushings so the gears fit with less ressistance which would infact be not the right thing to do at all..is this correct? thanks all

What is the proper way for the grove to face on the dog bone to the bearing or to the cam? the fsm say outwards towards cams just making sure that has not been somthing people have done differently ,for some reason it rings a bell.

[chevelle]

I have graphed the p's and the pb+ both.
You cannot judge the cams characteristics by just looking or comparing the profile.
The only thing you can see w/ the P's by just looking at them is that the apex of the lobe has a long plateau, which is the case.
The P's are more aggressive than the pb+'s.
The p exh has .035" less lift.

More info on cam fitment:
http://xlforum.net/vbportal/forums/s...d.php?t=878657

http://xlforum.net/vbportal/forums/s...d.php?t=726406

[Pan55]

with the andrews cams...you will have to find as stated above,,,

with the new cams if I remember right, they state that the cam *lash* or teeth mesh may be too tight to use,**in the install instruction sheet**( not due to machining problems from Andrews, rather in the very fine amount of differances in the cases/spacing between each individual cam bearing) and to contact them for a better fit** but you will have to determine which cam/or cams are the ones that are setting too deeply** into each other...

go to an auto parts store and get some gear blue ( forgot the exact name, brain fart going on here) its used to determine gear lash on rear end/differentials) and use that to see what cams are setting too deeply into each other..then contact Andrews and they will guide you from there...

[billeuze]

Originally Posted by timberjack

doodah man - my cases are split I have looked for the proper tool in canada and cant seem to find one, not sure of anyone in my area who can do this type of thing.

Where in Canada are you? I know one shop in Edmonton that has the tooling for line boring ironhead cams. I think its called "Hyperformance" and the guy top talk to is "Hyper Al"